Nine Pro Bowl selections. Seven division titles. Super Bowl champion in 1996. Most Valuable Player in three consecutive years. Most touchdown passes in NFL history. 283 consecutive games played. 164 wins as a quarterback—40 of them coming from behind. A lock for the Hall of Fame.
And I have the nerve to call him overrated?
Absolutely.
Brett Favre has always been one of the more popular players in the game, almost larger than life. His accomplishments are extremely revered and many of his records, including most consecutive games played and most MVP awards, may never be broken.
However, over the last 11 years Favre's failures, particularly in the postseason, have been largely overlooked and virtually ignored.
Recently, I read a B/R ranking on the greatest quarterbacks of all-time. Favre placed second on this list. I found this ranking to be absurd. I believe that there are two active quarterbacks with much more superior careers than Brett Favre (Manning and Brady).
Favre has a 12-10 career postseason record, including a Super Bowl ring (1996) and another Super Bowl appearance (1997). But in the last 11 years, Favre has won only three of his nine postseason starts. In a sport where the blame for a loss is placed on one position (quarterback) more frequently than any other sport, Favre's performances in January are inexcusable.
Favre escaped future criticism for his postseason play by winning a Super Bowl title early in his career (1996). Often, one Super Bowl title is all a quarterback needs to be forever considered a winner.
John Elway is 2-3 in the Super Bowl, with three blowout losses, but is considered to be one of the most clutch quarterbacks in NFL history. Both Eli and Peyton Manning can never again win a playoff game and, just like Favre, nobody will be able to take away their Super Bowl victory.
Let's closely examine Favre's postseason struggles, beginning in 2001.
In 2001, the Packers finished second in the NFC Central with a 12-4 mark. Favre led the Packers to a home win over the San Francisco 49ers, earning them the right to travel to
St. Louis to play the 14-2 Rams.
The Packers lost 45-17 and Brett Favre threw an NFL postseason record six interceptions, three of which were returned for touchdowns.
In 2002, the No.3 Packers hosted the No.6 Atlanta Falcons in the wild-card round. Brett Favre had never lost when the game time temperature was 34 degrees or below (a record of 35-0). The Packers had gone 8-0 at home in the regular season and no visiting team had ever won at Lambeau Field in the playoffs (13 games). The Falcons, led by 22-year-old Michael Vick, spanked the Packers 27-7.
In 2003, the Packers finished first in the division, winning 10 games. They defeated the Seattle Seahawks in overtime in the wild-card round of the playoffs, thanks to an interception touchdown by cornerback Al Harris.
In the NFC Divisional playoff game, Favre's overtime pass sailed over the head of the nearest Green Bay Packer. Brian Dawkins caught the pass—the only pass I've ever heard described a punt—and returned it 35 yards to set up David Akers' game-winning 31-yard field goal.
In 2004, the Packers again won the division with 10 games. They hosted the eight-win division rival Minnesota Vikings in the wild-card round—a team they had defeated twice in the regular season. But this time, the Packers were clobbered 31-17, as Favre threw four interceptions and fumbled once.
The Vikings joined that year's Rams as the only teams to win a playoff game without finishing above .500 during the regular season.
In 2007, the 13-3 Packers hosted the 10-6 Giants in the conference championship game, after demolishing the Seahawks 42-20 in the divisional playoffs. Tied 20-20 after regulation, Favre threw an interception to Corey Webster on the first play of overtime.
The Giants won on a 47-yard field goal, making Favre the first quarterback in the history of the NFL to throw an interception in overtime in a playoff game twice in a career.
Now I am absolutely not trying to take away from Favre's accomplishments in the playoffs before 2001, notably his Super Bowl win in 1996 and NFC championship in 1997.
Favre has thrown for the second most passing yards and the second most passing touchdowns in NFL playoff history. But he has also lost more games and thrown more playoff interceptions than any other quarterback.
Favre got the job done during the regular season as a starting quarterback. He has won 167 games, the most among quarterbacks. He ranks first all-time in touchdown passes, passing yards, completions, and attempts.
But he also holds one of the more dubious records in NFL history: He has thrown 300 interceptions in his career—328 if one counts the postseason. Combined with his 165 fumbles (71 lost), Favre has committed 399 turnovers in his NFL career—an average of slightly over 22 per season.
By comparison, Vinny Testaverde, a man who might as well have been known as Mr. Turnover, turned the ball over about 21 times per season. Eli Manning, who despite his Super Bowl ring has struggled in his short career, has turned the ball over 18 times per season. Rex Grossman, who in a recent article I called one of the more disgusting quarterbacks to ever play in the NFL, has averaged about 18 turnovers per season.
There is no way to hide or ignore this statistic. Not turning the ball over is one of the most important, if not the most important jobs of an NFL quarterback. Favre has struggled in this category.
Greatly, greatly struggled.
Five times in his career, Brett Favre has committed more turnovers than he has thrown touchdown passes.
In 2005, he turned in one of the more atrocious seasons by a quarterback in recent memory, tossing 29 interceptions while losing seven fumbles, for an NFL-high 36 turnovers in 16 games.
However, Brett Favre has earned a reputation for playing through pain, and rightfully so. And not just pain, but a swollen ankle supposedly six times its normal size. A broken thumb on his throwing hand, a sprained lateral collateral ligament in his left knee, elbow tendinitis, a sprained foot, turf toe, and a separated shoulder.
He was named the Toughest Athlete by USA Today in 2003. He has never missed a game due to injury and has missed just over one-percent of offensive plays in his career.
Supporters of Brett Favre will argue that he had very few, if any, superstar teammates. I will agree with this—to an extent.
The 1996 Super Bowl champion Packers sported the number one defense in the NFL, led by Reggie White, LeRoy Butler, and Darren Sharper. Sterling Sharpe is, in my opinion, the most underrated wide receiver in NFL history, and would have been a Hall of Famer if not for his neck injury. However, that was about it.
He had Antonio Freeman, William Henderson, Dorsey Levens, Ahman Green, Robert Brooks, Javon Walker, and Donald Driver. These were all very good players, but none would be considered one of the best players in the NFL.
Having a wide receiver like Jerry Rice or Marvin Harrison would have helped Favre complete more passes and throw more touchdown passes, but he would still be the king of turnovers.
Bottom line: Favre ranks first all-time in every single major passing category, including yards, touchdown passes, and wins. He earned three consecutive MVP awards and led the Packers to a Super Bowl victory in 1996. He played through more injuries than almost any player in history and has led 40 come-from-behind victories in his career.
Too many of his moments have been larger than life, and frankly overrated. He is given far too much credit for having fun and celebrating. He is a likeable guy and people want to view him as one of the three or four greatest quarterbacks to ever play the game.
But focus on the facts.
He flat-out choked in the playoffs in 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, and 2007. His '96 Packers were 1,000 times better than the New England Patriots, and it would have been considered an enormous disappointment had they lost the Super Bowl. The Pack was heavily favored against the Broncos in 1997 and did lose, costing Favre a second ring.
He forces way too many passes and has set interception records that may never be broken. The last 11 years of his career have not matched his first six seasons, and some of his full seasons have been flat-out disappointing for a quarterback in the NFL.
Favre is a fantastic quarterback, and probably the greatest in team history. But he is nowhere near number one and struggles to crack my list of the top 10 quarterbacks of all-time.
177 comments Last one added 3 months ago — Leave a Comment
Ken Lord 7 months ago
I love these articles that talk about how overrated Brett Favre is... or any article that says how overrated any particular player is. As if becoming a hall of fame caliber player is easy as pie. Bleacher Report is plagued by these stupid pointless opinion pieces.
This article came after an amazing performance Favre had against the Patriots, so I can only assume it came out as a rebuttal of sorts for that praise. You could easily write a report about Matt Cassel who did an amazing job in that Jets/Patriots match up and talk about how much he sucks just because he didn't win the game.
Great players don't get the attention or adulation they receive by being mediocre. Like it or not Favre is a great player. I guess if I should use your criteria to judge Dan Marino is just some nobody.
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David Stelter 7 months ago
you're completely right. No Hall of Famer should be considered "overrated," but let's be honest: if anyone's overrated it's Manning considering he's always had great receivers to pad his stats. That's a luxury Favre hasn't had for about 90% of his career.
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David Stelter 7 months ago
you're completely right. No Hall of Famer should be considered "overrated," but let's be honest: if anyone's overrated it's Manning considering he's always had great receivers to pad his stats. That's a luxury Favre hasn't had for about 90% of his career.
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Michael Inglis 7 months ago
Don't be so critical. The author made some good points and backed them up with stats/facts.
There is no doubt that Farve is a great player but he gets treated like a God by the media. Rarely does anyone in the media talk bad about him even after he cost his team a game.
Farve's postseason record is 12-10 and if you take the Super Bowl years out he's 7-9. Compare that to Brady who is 15-3 in the playoffs.
Farve also holds the NFL record for most INT thrown in a career and some of his INT just make you wondering what is going on in his head. I remember watching that Eagles playoff game and in OT he just threw the ball up into the air ON 1ST DOWN and the Eagles player intercepted it. Not exageratting, the Eagles player was the only one in my TV screen. Also, last year against the Giants was an awful pass that loss them the game.
He's also had 5 years where his QB rating was in the 70s. That's not good.
From 1994-1998 he averged 35 TD and 16 INT.
The rest of his career he's averaged 24 TD and 19 INT. That's okay but not spectacular.
Farve had a great 5 year run but after that he's just been average.
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RedSox Maniac 7 months ago
What is opinionated about the articles. Did Favre win these games in the playoffs?
I think overrated is harsh, even though I put it in the title of my article. But my article was just on this year, and not his previous. The turnover part is surprising.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Ken, I fail to see your point. This isn't about one game and I wouldn't write an article about Matt Cassel after 10 games.
Favre is not as good as people think he is. End of story. He is a great player. Notice I stated that.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
David, a Hall of Famer can absolutely be considered overrated. Why would being a Hall of Famer ban you from potential criticism?
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stacey jackson 7 months ago
Anyone who thinks Brett Favre is overrated is an idiot> What quarterback doesn't throw interceptions? Just look at his stats. Not many can play the game - and at such a difficult position - as Favre has. People need to stop hating on him for being so good.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
What quarterback doesn't throw interceptions? None. What quarterback throws significantly less than Brett Favre? Lots.
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Derek Lofland 7 months ago
If you want to know how one sided this article was I can point to one thing. Packers lost to the Eagles in the playoff game, because Favre threw an OT pick. Not even one mention that the Packers defense gave up a 4th and 26 with under 2 minutes to allow the Eagles to tie the game in the first place. Also, not one mention that Favre threw 3 touchdown passes in the Packers Super Bowl loss and that the defense gave up 157 yards and 3 rushing TDs to Terrell Davis. It's going to be funny for the Favre haters when he retires. What this author wrote has been said for the last 10 years, yet the legacy of #4 is as strong as ever. Go #4 and Go Jets!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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RedSox Maniac 7 months ago
This article is one-sided. But I like the side. That is a lot of choking.
Top 10 QB all-time. By far. But number 2? Ehh.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Yeah...that sucks for him that his defense gave up that big play. But the biggest play by a defense in that game was caused by Brett Favre's punt, excuse me, pass on first down.
Every quarterback has been both helped and screwed over by their defenses before. The Packer defense gave up 20 points that game. That's average.
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Cody Swartz 7 months ago
Derek, nowhere does the author state that he hates Brett Favre. He simply says he is overrated.
I find it extremely annoying how people assume that simply because a person finds an athlete overrated, he hates him. Not true. You can find an athlete overrated and still like him.
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Ari Horing 7 months ago
nice aritcle..I was going to write this aritcle. You are completley right.
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C Douglas Baker 7 months ago
Nice article and I am with you 100% on this. I was actually sad to see Farve retire becuase I have loved to watch him play, but the way he jerked around the Packers has left a little sour taste in mouth. And I am not even a Packers fan.
Here are my comments about Farve the day he retired, which shows how much I admire him (although some of that luster is gone per the above) and my allusion that he is overrated, although it was soft there given the context of the post.
I guess I understand why Packers fans come to his defense in this debate. He did make the team what it was. No Brett Farve and the Packers likely would have been mired in mediocrity for years. But I know one thing, I don't know any knowledgable Packer's fan that is rooting for Farve now. The way the trade was set up, the better the Jets do the more the Packers have to give up in the draft. And if they go to the playoffs, the price for the trade gets even steeper for the Packers. So all the Packers fans I know are rooting for the Jets to lose and not make it. Which makes them pals of mine. The enemy of my enemy is my friend and all that! (Being a Patriots fan...)
http://cdbaker.wordpress.com/2008/03/04/brett-farve-retires/
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Ken Lord 7 months ago
If those Packer fans aren't cheering for Favre then they aren't that knowledgeable. The terms of the deal favor the Packers depending on how well the Jets do. The terms of the deal are as such. If Favre takes 50 percent of total snaps with the Jets in 2008, the fourth-rounder becomes a third-round pick. If he gets 70 percent of the snaps and the Jets make the playoffs, it becomes a second-round pick; and if he gets 80 percent of snaps and the Jets make the Super Bowl, it becomes a first-round pick.
Sorry, but the Packers and their fans want Favre and the Jets to win.
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C Douglas Baker 7 months ago
hmm, I know a lot of Packers fans and none of them are rooting for Farve. They don't want to give up a second round pick, much less a first rounder. Not sure what you are talking about...
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Ken Lord 7 months ago
The Packers aren't giving up any kind of draft pick! The Jets are giving away their draft picks to Green Bay depending on how well the Jets do! That's what I'm talking about. The better the Jets do = The better draft pick for Green Bay.
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C Douglas Baker 7 months ago
Got ya, my brain quit functioning there obviously!! I guess the Pack fans I know are rooting against him because they are pissed off the way his retirement and trade went down.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Guys, Packer fans are rooting for Favre because they want a good draft pick. Think about it.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
C Douglas, I've always thought that you should know how to spell someone's name if you're talking about them. It's Favre.
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C Douglas Baker 7 months ago
Get over it. It was a typo. :)
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RG Yoho 7 months ago
I don't necessarily agree with you, but I like how you reached your conclusion! Good read.
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Ken Lord 7 months ago
Actually the Packer fans want Brett Favre to do well. They aren't giving away draft picks they are getting draft picks based on how well Favre does. The snaps he takes and depending on how far the Jets go gives the Packers better draft choices.
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Ken Lord 7 months ago
The Packers aren't giving up any kind of draft pick! The Jets are giving away their draft picks to Green Bay depending on how well the Jets do! That's what I'm talking about. The better the Jets do = The better draft pick for Green Bay.
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Brad Frank 7 months ago
I didn't even have to read the article to agree with you. I am hated among my peers for me stance on Brett Favre as I often declare him the "Most Overrated Athlete of All-Time."
Good stuff, my friend.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
The Most Overrated Athlete of all-time???? Haha, I might agree actually :)
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Jack Robertson 7 months ago
I agree, because he really is, and his whole "Kid like energy" act is really pissing me off.
He came back two seasons ago to break all the records, we all know it, not because he is obssessed with football
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Zach Kruse 7 months ago
Your wrong. He obviously loves football, he can't seem to leave it. He's never been about records or any of that...he just loves playing ball.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
I 100% agree. The kid like energy stuff. People love that and it's one of the biggest reasons he's overrated.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Zach, you can love football as much as you want, but it doesn't mean you are one of the best at it.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
And trust me, everybody who says they dont care about records is lying. They care. I'm not saying they're incredibly selfish or anything, but they care.
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David Arreola 7 months ago
Anybody who says they don't care about records is lying?
Perhaps, but if he really did care about them...why come back for this year? He came back because he loves the game...will you guys listen to yourselves before you open your ignorent mouths.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
But I think the reason he kept playing past the miserable 2005 season was to break all-time passing records. I think if he held the records, he'd be gone.
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David Arreola 7 months ago
Or maybe he wanted another ring? Why do you think Elway stayed? Or Marino for that matter?
All of these speculations and guesses are only assumptions.
Unless you speak to Brett Favre on a daily basis, you wouldn't know why he came back. So we have to go with what we know, and for 17 years he has been the most honest man in football. He said he came back to win and play football. So that is what he came back to do.
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Bob Cunningham 7 months ago
if the only reason he stayed was to get all the records, he wouldnt be playing right now.
right?
he's got them, yet he's playing.
He loves football. period. end of story.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
He can be the happiest person in the world. It doesn't make him a better player.
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Bob Cunningham 7 months ago
you're right. cause it doesnt get any better than Brett Favre.
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Matthew Henkel 7 months ago
He is by far the most overrated But the media loves him. All he does is whine. His turnovers barely ever are talked about and its about time someone brought it up. Great Article.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
In one sentence, you just sunmmed up completely how I feel.
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Matt Schaefer 7 months ago
I like how the article was written and how the imformation was presented but I highly disagree with you about Favre being overrated.
Not to mention that Favre is one of the toughest players ever to play the game, and owns all the records, your reasoning has Dan Marino as "overrated" also with a playoff record of 8-10 (0 Superbowls) and 24 INTs in those playoff games.
Favre is one of the best and yes the INTs are up there but like you also pointed out he didnt have jerry rice and others like him to throw to. Face it, Favre is one of the best and at the worst, in the top 10.
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RedSox Maniac 7 months ago
Only Montana had Jerry Rice.
Have you seen Tom Brady's team before Randy Moss. Name me three Wide-outs he had that were any good.
There you go. He can be the toughest, he can own all the records, but are you also implying Jamie Moyer is better than Pedro Martinez?
Apples and oranges. A lot of QBs are tough, and don't have great wide-outs. And I'm sorry, but you cannot tell me that QBs would hate to have Antonio Freeman, Donald Driver, Ahman Greene, and Sterling Sharpe to throw to ( yes, he threw to his backs a lot ).
These guys were great players. No way you're about to diss them just because they didn't have the longevity to end up in the HOF. No way you're gonna tell me those players weren't good.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Ok, but listen to me. 2 quarterbacks had Jerry Rice to throw to. Montana and Young. Are the rest overrated?
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
RedSox is right. You want to give a quarterback props for not having good receivers to throw to, don't pick Favre because he only had very very good players instead of Hall of Famers. Pick someone like Donovan who threw to Charles Johnson and Torrance Small his first years. That was a disaster.
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Matt Schaefer 7 months ago
Sorry top 5 not top 10 and this is coming from a Bills fan who has to watch Favre go out and kick butt with the Jets now 8(.
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Alexeiv Goodenov 7 months ago
The 2001 Rams were unstoppable and eventually lost only by a cheat.
So you can't blame him for that loss.
And the Vick led Falcons that year were actually pretty solid.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
You can't blame him for that loss?! They lost by 28 points because he threw six interceptions. You can't even blame the defense because 21 points were off interception touchdowns!!!
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
The Falcons were a road team in Green Bay. They should not have won. I could overlook it if the score was 20-17. Not 27-7 (24-0 at halftime).
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Thomas 7 months ago
favre isn't overrated. he's overexposed. he's a good guy who gets hours of coverage from ESPN
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David Geller 7 months ago
Bingo.
Honestly though... I think Favre is selfish and a jerk. He's a terrific player though. I just don't have much respect for him as a person.
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Thomas 7 months ago
as a player he's awesome. as a person...he's a small town guy over enjoying himself in the city.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Thomas, that's what overrated is.
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Thomas 7 months ago
overrated is giving someone too much attention.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
And from what I've seen, I've actually always thought he was a nice guy, maybe not. Any Packers fan out there who can comment?
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Thomas 7 months ago
idk....are there?
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Doug Dwyer 7 months ago
I really don't care how you want to rate Favre. I have been a big Packers fan for 40 years. He took over QB on a team that hadn't been to the playoffs in 22 years. When I described that to my son, he said, "So they were the Lions of 70's and 80's?" Yeah, that's what the Packers were before Favre (and Holgrem and Wolf). Holgrem and Wolf left, but the Packers continued to play at a high level. Brett Favre has averaged over 10 wins per season through three general managers and four head coaches. In that span, the Packers had ONE losing season. Now this year without him, the Packers are 4-5.
Favre is a winner.
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Michael Inglis 7 months ago
The Packers being 4-5 has little to do with Rodgers. His QB rating is 93. The Packers are worse this year becuase their defense sucks and Ryan Grant is a one year wonder.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Yup he is a winner and is better than the other quarterbacks you've had ever. Tell me why he's not overrated.
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Royce Hoehn 7 months ago
Yes, Tom Brady is one of the best quarterbacks of all time people just do not like to admit it because he is still kicking ass right now, despite his current knee injury. Everyone hates when players are still active because we as fans do not like seeing other teams succeed so we hate on them and criticize them as athletes or how good they are.
I do think Farve is overated though. JOHN ELWAY, TOM BRADY, JOE MONTANA, PEYTON MANNING, DAN MARINO has anyone heard of these guys
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RedSox Maniac 7 months ago
I can't put Brady up there yet. He needs a few more years to solidify himself.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Royce, I think all of those are better than Brett Favre except for Elway.
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jeff ircink 7 months ago
good conversation people. nice.
Red Sox, etal: if you read my post, i never said i'm pro or con regarding Favre NOR did i affirm or deny any points in the article. i simply said articles like THAT ONE are a dime a dozen. anytime you write about rating a QB or TOP 10 QBs, it's gonna be subjective. period. there's no one determining factor that results in an end-all decision. wanna base it soley on stats - Favre wins, hands down. and sure he has the INT record. but that's what happens when you play 18 years in the league. how many times does this point have to made. Cy Young had the most saves AND losses. Babre Ruth was the HR leader - also had the most strike outs. what don't you understand.
Red Sox - which of my articles did you think sucked, and why?
Jack - if you think Favre came back the last two years for his stats and records, you are an idiot. you most certainly live under a rock.
what else?
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Craig Swartz 7 months ago
Obviously, what YOU don't understand are your facts. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and I suppose you meant to type Cy Young had the most WINS and losses. As far as Babe Ruth, what are you talking about? The Babe isn't even close to the most strikeouts. In fact, his total is about half of the all time leader, Reggie Jackson. Jackson has 2597, Ruth 1330. The most k's he had in a single season is 93 and only led the league 5 times in a 22 year career. Babe isn't even in the top 50. Maybe before you criticize someone else you should do a little research. It's not that difficult.
As far as Favre having the int record, you say that's what happens when you play 18 yrs. No, that's what happens when you make stupid throws. I don't understand why he continues to get a free pass with regards to his picks. He makes some brutal throws in critical situations. Hall of Famer? Yes. Top 10 all time? Probably. He just doesn't walk on water.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Jeff if all articles are subjective why are you so personally offended?
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jeff ircink 7 months ago
whoever said the Pack being 4-5 has little to do with Rogers...you're SORT of right.
those 4 points for safeties last week - on Rogers, and the game was lost.
yeh they have injuries and yeh the OL is suspect in protecting Rogers.
but one thing you CAN blame on Rogers is that he doesn't bring an "i'm a winner" attitude to the team. he can't. he's got a 4-5 record in his first year as a starter.
the instant cache and the attitude the Jets are talking about that Favre brings to the team; that "we can win this" mentality once Favre steps in the huddle or on the field...Rogers has none of that.
can any of you seriously argue that point.
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jeff ircink 7 months ago
"He flat-out choked in the playoffs in 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, and 2007. His '96 Packers were 1,000 times better than the New England Patriots, and it would have been considered an enormous disappointment had they lost the Super Bowl. The Pack was heavily favored against the Broncos in 1997 and did lose, costing Favre a second ring."
another thing - people are quick to say, "it's unfair to say the QB gets the win because the QB isn't the only one playing the game". like the Jets' victory over the Rams last week - Favre had one TD and about 160 yards. minimal. but efficient, with a 118 rating. and a win.
these same people, like the author of this article, then say that Favre is mostly responsible for the team's losses ("choked" in the above games). how can a QB not get a full credit for a win but get all the credit for the loss.
and when you write the Pack beat the Patriots in the SB, you have to ahead and put the caveat, "would have been an enormous disappointment had they lost...". they WON! why can't you just leave it at that?
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Dude, I never said that its unfair to say the QB gets the win because the QB isnt the only one playing the game. Try to get your facts right.
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David Arreola 7 months ago
1) You got a problem with my article you say it to my FACE.
2) Mr. Overrated? How about Mr. TD? Mr. Yards? Mr. Completions? Mr. Starts? Mr. Most Wins by an NFL quarterback? Hell, even Mr. Interception.
NOT MR. Overrated.
This article is a bunch of facts that are being viewed from a very biased point of view. I applaude your research and voicing your dislike of Favre. But, there is no doubt Favre is one of the greatest quarterbacks of all-time. #2? Sounds right to me.
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Michael Inglis 7 months ago
You said it, Mr. Starts. A lot of QB post better per season stats than him he's just been around for a long time.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Dude I liked the article that you wrote. Pretty sure I nominated it for a Pick of the Day vote.
I disagree and I'm allowed to do that.
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brian hancock 7 months ago
It is what you do with the starts. . . He has won 167 games.
From 1992 - 2007 - he has thrown 5,000+ yards above the league average; thrown 108 TDs above the league average;
They just do no let you play starting QB in the NFL and the fact he has is a feat in itself, but the fact he has done it very well lead him to all those numbers. If he played at an average level statistically, he would no longer be in the league.
Again, they just do not let you hang around in the NFL. It is a young man's game and he is still playing very well in a 39 year old body.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Once Favre had established himself as a legend, he didn't need to perform as well. They're not going to take away the starting job of a 3-time MVP even if he throws 15 touchdowns and 35 interceptions. His job security was never in jeopardy. But if some of the seasons he had later in his career had happened earlier, he may have not stayed on the team for as long.
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David Arreola 7 months ago
Bryn, you do know it was the popular consensus to have Favre at #2 right? He was 70 points clear of 3rd which was the great Johnny Unitas. I even said I applaude your research and voicing your dislike of Favre, so nice try to make me look like an ass.
Fact is, you are seeing this from a very biased point of view. Like a Military recruiter. Only telling one side of the story, the story you think people should hear.
He has had two really bad seasons his entire career. 2005+2006. 2005 was a really bad year, but Peyton Manning had a 3-13 season, so Its unfair for you to crucify Favre for that.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
I could understand that you think I am seeing from a very biased point of view if it weren't for the fact that I stated all of his accomplishments in the first paragraph. I'm not biased. Favre hasn't beat up on the Eagles over the years. We actually liked playing him because he would usually blow the game at the end (2003, 2005).
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Steven Resnick 7 months ago
Brett Favre is one of the greatest of all-time but if you're looking for a quarterback to get it done. As in get you a Superbowl win then it's definitely not Favre. Seeing how he's only got 1 ring. Another thing is that Favre has always had solid receivers.
Someone said that Favre lacked solid wide receivers when he was in his prime. That's bogus information. Ever heard of Sterling Sharpe? From '92-'94 Sharpe had 314 catches for 3854 yards and 42 touchdowns. Averaging 105 catches per year 1285 yards and 14 touchdowns. Sure sounds like Favre has never had any solid receivers.
Once Sharpe had retired due to injuries. In '95 Favre had Robert Brooks to throw too and during that year he had 102 catches, 1497 yards, and 13 touchdowns. After Brooks was injured the ropes were handed to Antonio Freeman.
Freeman himself from '97-01' averaged 71 catches, 1094 yards, and 9 touchdowns. I could list the other receivers as well that became the top receiver for Favre. Too say that Favre wasn't surrounded by good receivers is ignorant. It's true he may never of had one receiver that stayed throughout his whole time with the Packers, but he still had talented wide receivers.
So, yeah I definitely agree that Favre is overrated!
If you look at John Elway he may have gotten beat in 3 superbowls but he came back in '97 and '98 to win 2 superbowls. Twice as many superbowl rings as Favre. Even in the playoffs though Elway has a better career record in one less game. Elway's record in the playoffs is at 14-7.
Joe Montana arguably the best qb ever to play the game. Montana went 4-0 in the Superbowls. Playoff wise Montana has a record of 16-7.
Terry Bradshaw in the playoffs is a record of 14-5. He also has 4 superbowl rings.
That definitely knocks Favre to at least number 4. Sorry, but there's no way that Favre is number 2 as greatest quarterback ever.
Again Favre is definitely overrated.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Yup, Favre is absolutely not my quarterback for my playoff game.
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brian hancock 7 months ago
Never missed a game in over 16 seasons
16 seasons of 3,000 or more yards
8 seasons of 30 or more TDs
13 seasons of 20 or more TDs
16 seasons of 300 or more completions
63,000 yards passings
460 TDs (only one other player with 400 TDs)
3 MVPs
He has played in over 20 playoff games
Seriously, he deserves any credit he gets. It's not easy to be a QB in the NFL, it's even harder to play in a top ten level. It's even harder to win 3 MVPs.
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Michael Inglis 7 months ago
Brett Farve has really only had 5 great years and after that he's just been average.
1994-1998: Averaged 35 TD and 16 INT, 3 MVPs, 2 Super Bowl apperances. 9-4 postseason record.
His other 11 years: Averaged 24 TD and 19 INT, 0 MVPs, 0 Super Bowl apperances. 3-6 postseason record.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Nowhere do I get into the fact of whether or not QB is difficult to play. Of course it's difficult. It's also the 1 position where you need to win in the playoffs.
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brian hancock 7 months ago
Averaging 24 TDs a game for 11 season is still impressive.
Going with the logic that only the post-season makes you great. So Jim Plunkett is a better QB than Favre. Brad Johnson is better than Dan Marino. Dilfer and Favre are equals if you are basing things off of post-season.
With that said, on average Favre has played better in the regular season than the playoffs. Bart Starr is the greatest post-season QB winning five championships, two Super Bowls (before they were Super Bowls) and only losing one. He has been above average essentially every season he put a helmet on.
If you are looking over the last five seasons, has thrown 32 more TDs, passed for over 1900 yards, completed 3.2% more passes, had 482 more completions against 382 more attempts. This includes his only losing season of 4-12, which was the worst of his career.
Favre has lead the Packers to 5 more post-season games than through the entire history of the Packers (74 years prior to Favre there were only 17 post season games; with Favre 22). The Packers had 1 postseason game in the 70s and 2 in the 80s and 22 in the 90s and 00s under Favre.
I ran the numbers here: http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dfd9jckz_25gkbng7dg&hl=en
Favre has a winning record in the playoffs, including losing to the Super Bowl champions last season in overtime.
Again, if just winning the big game in the post season, then Jim Plunkett is a better than Brett Favre, Steve Young, Jim Kelly, Dan Marino, Donavan McNabb, Dan Fouts, Peyton Manning, Eli Manning, Ben Rothlisberger, et. al.
I wouldn't have Plunkett in my Top 25 list QBs of all time. Where is he on yours since a QB greatness is only determined by post-season wins?
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Find me where I stated that a quarterback is only ranked by postseason wins. Seriously, find that.
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Matt Schaefer 7 months ago
I don't get what this article is suppose to be anymore. You are saying that Favre sucks because he doesnt win in the playoffs and played in so many years that of course he should have all of the records. That is a complete joke.
That is saying Marino (no superbowl rings, 8-10 playoff record, 252 INTs, 17 seasons), Warren Moon (no superbowls, 233 INTS, 17 seasons), and Jim Kelly (no superbowl wins, 175 INTs, 11 seasons) are all terrible.
Favre holds the record in all major passing categories because he has played at such a high level for such a long time. Name me one other player who has put up stats like him year in and year out. No to mention his toughness. If I broke your thumb right now (this is to prove a point, not a threat) you wouldnt even try to use it until it healed up. Brett played through it. He has played through even worse injuries. The guy is a warrior and has paided the price for everything he has right now.
And Redsox or whoever commented up there somewhere, please. You are just being a homer. Look what friggen Matt Casell who didnt play a game since high school has done it that offense. Brady didnt win those trophies by himself either. Its a team sport, not just one guy on the field.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Matt. Listen to me. This is important advice. When you comment on an article, do not say that the author claims a player sucks, unless the author actually does claim that the player sucks. I believe I stated in my last paragraph that he is a top 10 quarterback.
I give Favre credit for his injuries. I list about ten of them. What more do you want?
I am not Brett Favre. Of course I would not play with a broken thumb.
How can you be confused by this article? You may disagree, but I am pretty sure it is obvious what I am stating.
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Steven Resnick 7 months ago
Favre holds all the records for most touchdowns, most completions, most interceptions, and 2nd most fumbles for a reason. It's not because he stayed at a high level for so long. He's a good quarterback and that's it. He's not great he's overrated. He's only won 1 superbowl and he's thrown the most interceptions out of the two you also mentioned in Kelly and Marino. That's during his peak Favre threw an astounding number of interceptions that year. The number 29.
So guess why Favre has so many completions it's because he's always getting his team behind with his lame duck throws and having his team fall behind.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Seriously, Brett Favre played 17 years and won one Super Bowl. That's above average. It's not total greatness.
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Matt Schaefer 7 months ago
Because at first I thought the article was a good read, well written, but I just didnt agree with it at all. Then the comments have just spiraled the whole thing downhill. I guess what I dont see is how is a top 10 QB is overrated?
When who is the Greatest QBs in the game come up in conversation, I think Montana, Marino, Favre, Brady, Manning, etc, etc and also wished they played for my team. To say Favre is overrated is just crazy. Are you telling me that you wouldnt want him on your team at anypoint in his career?
And of course Favre is getting love from ESPN like now like crazy because he is one of the best in the game and we will most likely never see anyone play the game like him again. Everytime the Pats do good Brady is shoved down our throats. Same with Mannings and now even Eli. That is why I think they were doing so much with Trent Edwards, Joe Flacco, Matt Ryan this year. It is the most important position in the NFL and ESPN and other national media outlets want to cover the next big thing.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
The other article ranked him at 2. Most people think he is at 4 or 5. I think that's way too high. Too me, the difference between the 4th and the 9th QB is a lot.
I would have loved Favre on my team. I think McNabb outplayed him several years, but Favre would have been nice.
And too much focus is put on Favre having fun and enjoying the game than his actual success.
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Steven Resnick 7 months ago
If I had a choice of Steve Young, Joe Montana, Johnny Unitas, Joe Namath, Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, Dan Marino, John Elway, Terry Bradshaw, Jim Kelly, or Brett Favre. I would take them over Favre any day.
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Matt Schaefer 7 months ago
The part about him enjoying the game is because what athlete have we seen do that in the NFL? Vick is behind bars, as soon as peyton comes off the field he is looking at more plays, brady is always looking pissed about something or yelling when they dont go for it on 4th and 20 with a 60 point lead...
We have and most likely never will see a grown man who plays the game like this. The guy just loves football and plays it like a kid. That is how players should play. Dont let money change you, just enjoy what you do and treat everyplay like it is your last.
Personally I think Favre is in the top 5 but we can back and forth on numbers all day.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Ok, but listen. He could have more fun than anybody in the history of mankind but it shouldnt change his ranking because he doesnt deserve to move up because he has fun.
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Steven Resnick 7 months ago
Matt have you ever seen Jerry Rice play? Now there's a man who loved playing football too. Would you ever see him act like a spoiled little brat because he didn't get his way? Nope. He acted with class when San Francisco didn't want his services anymore. You didn't see Jerry go whine and cry to the media because his GM didn't want him anymore.
He signed with Oakland did his thing. Played with Oakland and Seattle in his last year in the league and retired on his own terms. What could be said is at least Jerry Rice didn't pout and call a press conference after San Francisco no longer needed him and subsequently retire and then a few months later decide I want to play again.
You then didn't see Rice text messaging his GM/coach stating he wanted to play again. If Favre was really that professional and that fun loving football player. He would have done it privately with the owner of the Packers. Too gauge if he they wanted his services back or if he could work out a buyout. Instead he took it public and Favre embarrassed himself and the NFL with his actions.
Sorry, but Favre's actions this year just prove about his selfishness. I forgot hadn't Favre been thinking about retiring for the past few years before this little episode? Yes. Favre was only playing to break Marino's touchdown record. There's no doubt about that. Favre is in fact a selfish player. The problem is that people fall for his act, his boyish southern charm that people talk about.
When in reality he's only got one superbowl ring. Heck Trent Dilfer has taken a team to the superbowl and won. One ring isn't impressive for a supposed top 5 quarterback. That argument about the superbowl with Marino and Jim Kelly works just the same as well. They are great quarterbacks but they aren't the greatest because of the glaring fact that they haven't won a superbowl.
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Doug Dwyer 7 months ago
Steven,
The Packers management said Favre couldn't play for the Packers AND he couldn't play for anyone else. They refused to release him and weren't going to trade him until he showed up at training camp. Favre went public because he wanted to play again. He was the returning Pro Bowl QB of the NFC and was 2nd in MVP behind Tom Brady. The Packers held Brett Favre hostage.
Why is Favre forced to decide 8 months before anyone else? It was the fans and media that threw gasoline on the fire wanting to know what Favre was going to do the day after the NFC Championship. Just wait until training camp and see what happens, but Favre is held to a much higher standard. Get over it.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Douglas, this is the NFL. A man cannot decide that he wants to play in the league again in mid-Jily or whenever it was. I think it might have been even later. You couldn't join a high school football team if you decided that late that you wanted to play. Why should he have been allowed back in the NFL? It's not fair to the Packers that after he retired and they named Rodgers the quarterback, that he then announced that he wanted to play again. It was too late.
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Matt Schaefer 7 months ago
The part about him enjoying the game is because what athlete have we seen do that in the NFL? Vick is behind bars, as soon as peyton comes off the field he is looking at more plays, brady is always looking pissed about something or yelling when they dont go for it on 4th and 20 with a 60 point lead...
We have and most likely never will see a grown man who plays the game like this. The guy just loves football and plays it like a kid. That is how players should play. Dont let money change you, just enjoy what you do and treat everyplay like it is your last.
Personally I think Favre is in the top 5 but we can back and forth on numbers all day.
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brian hancock 7 months ago
How exactly is Brett Favre overrated if in the comments he has been called "great" and a "Hall of Famer" by those criticizing him?
He still has 160 more TDs than interceptions.
He still has more playoff wins than losses
If this is about John Madden and what other commentators say about him, then the article should be based on the media coverage.
With that said, he is fun to watch, seems to enjoy himself out there, has a good story, the weird passes from different angles - throwing across his body, throwing with is feet rolling back, has overcome potentially career ending personal decisions (drug addiction, alcohol, man whore), has overcome injuries. If you are watching a game, Favre's play is usually your focus point, be it good or bad.
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Matt Schaefer 7 months ago
I agree that is what I have been trying to say. How is a Qb who is a first ballot hall of famer overrated?
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brian hancock 7 months ago
Matt - good point - sorry I missed your previous posts. If there was a trial on whether or not Favre is a great QB, everything has to be considered. He is a great QB - he is a first ballot HOFer - and he has the most INTs in the regular season.
It is also subjective.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Someone can be considered great and a Hall of Famer and also overrated. Deal with it.
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jeff ircink 7 months ago
bryn
you alluded to the fact that QBs get the credit for the win and get the credit for the loss when you mentioned that Favre "flat-out choked in the playoffs in 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, and 2007." no - you didn't say it verbatim, sorry. but you didn't say the team was part of those playoff loses either.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
The team was part of the playoff losses. But many times Favre contibuted to the loss more than any other player on the team. Six interceptions. Overtime interceptions. Stuff like that is on him.
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jeff ircink 7 months ago
and i like how michael stated "His other 11 years: Averaged 24 TD and 19 INT, 0 MVPs, 0 Super Bowl appearances. 3-6 postseason record."
you could pick many QBs careers apart this way and show a decline in performance. winning 1 MVP is a big deal for any QB ; Favre wins 3 BUT he didn't win any in the later part of his career. poor Brett,
that's bull. Marino didn't win a SB. where will Bryn rank him? the subjectivity of the topic makes this all laughable. Favre will be ranked accordingly by those who like and dislike him. he's a first ballot hall of famer and holds every QB record that's significant. period. does any of this really matter?
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Jeff, Marino's ranking--maybe 6 or 7. Probably a little above Favre. This is irrelevant though.
He holds every QB record imaginable but why does nobody take away from the fact that he has thrown 300 interceptions? You can't ignore this and act like it didn't happen. He throws many many critical interceptions in close games that lose games.
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thomas moreland 7 months ago
writing just to start debate is idiotic and i think you are called a troll? write because you are passionate about it or you may have thoght of something that sparked your interest. no one blames crappy defense or poor line play or poor coaching decisions. just blame a quarterback who plays because he loves the game. dunb article. saying brett favre is overrated is like saying dont strive to never give up, don t play through pain and adversity, don t be all you can be in life. take the safe way out never take a chance cause people might say your overrated. try to refocus on articles with thought and class not a hatchet job on someone that you couldn t carry his jock strap without screwing it up somehow!
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Thomas, I wrote about this because it sparked my interest. Apparently you're the idiot because you lowered yourself to commenting on something that was written 'just to start debate.'
You may disagree, but don't call this a hatchet job. A hatchet job is "Brett Favre sucks." I called the man a top ten quarterback.
I don't care if Brett Favre loves life. I'm focusing on his playing career.
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Jim Schultz 7 months ago
I'm a packer fan. Live in Northcentral Wisconsin. Less than 60 miles from "the frozen tundra". I was reading about what a few people earlier said about packer fans not wanting Brett to do well. Would that explain why CBS runs 2 minute commercials bragging about how the Jets will be on their local channel? I'd guess there are as many people buying Jets' Favre Jerseys in Wisconsin as there are Jets fans doing the same. We inherited a normal kid from a tiny town in Mississippi, and made him our reason to root for the Packers again. Most of us remember the Eighties and Seventies only too well. He grew up as a Packer. He did alot of HUMAN things. I'll be the first guy to call the moron who likes to criticize him for his past just that... A moron. He's human and was very impressionable. We live in a state known to toss back a few brews with our brats, cheese and even cheerios. The people that fell off his band wagon here are finding they are very unwelcome to come back on. We don't need em!
Brett broke all of our records, the good and the bad, then he set out to break all of the national records. We're very proud of who Brett turned into. He and his wife Deanne have raised alot of money for a number of charities. The biggest of which is the breast cancer foundation. Who would have ever guessed you'd see THOUSANDS of Green Bay Packer PINK hats? I'm proud to say I have one and have given many away for Xmas.
So the guy that claims to Know Packer Fans. YOU DON'T KNOW CRAP. The ones you claim to know are fly by night wagon jumping idiots. We don't need em...
jim
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
I fail to see your point. He broke all of your team records. Yup, he's the best QB in team history. He raised money for charities. He's human. No one of this defends the fact that he is overrated.
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Jim Schultz 7 months ago
Once you get out of diapers and that second pube pops up, maybe you'll have grown up enough to know that there is a man in that #4 uniform. To be a great QB you can't be some stoneheaded/hearted pompous jerk. In NO WAY do I mean the Brady or Manning or any of the other FUTURE greats aren't decent men. The word overrated is way too narrow. Think of all the superstars of the past. Most of which if you dig hard enough, you'll find flaws. It's the size of the heart that makes the very greatest football players. Think of Johnny Unitas, Joe Namath, Roger Staubach... the list is endless. They are all said with the great ones. When in reality their numbers can't even compare to the "great" players of today. But it doesn't make them overrated. Most people use that word when the person being talked about isn't on the team they follow. Favre was criticized that he wouldn't miss a game because he didn't want to give up the glory. Great words from people who never played more than PoP Warner football. I played football for a total of 13 years. You figure out what level my final years were played at. I broke 6 ribs, my right forearm and my ACL is shot after 3 surgeries. The man had a lot of pain, he wanted to play. That's why he's NOT overrated, just under appreciated.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Listen, I don't care if your arms fell off. That's not relevant and you know it. Favre played through pain and he was great but he didn't perform as well as people think he did.
And my argument wasn't that Brett Favre is a stoneheaded pompous jerk.
If heart is all that matters, then Rocky Bleier is the greatest player of all time, because that man had heart.
I challenge you to not insult me and focus on my facts. If you disagree, tell me how.
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jeff ircink 7 months ago
how can Marino be ahead of Favre - no mor QB records and no SB ring.
and i already mentioned, the INTs come with Favre's length of play.
Babe ruth = most HR and most strikeouts
Cy young = most saves and most losses
the fact that there is no definitive list on who ranks higher in QBs means it's subjective at best.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Cy Young had the most wins. Not the saves. Good try.
Babe Ruth does not have the most strikeouts or the most home runs.
How can Marino be ahead of Favre? Because he didn't have mediocre crappy seasons like Favre for the later end of his career and Marino had no running game to help.
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Michael Inglis 7 months ago
Why do you keep saying Babe Ruth has the most strikeouts when he is no where near the top.
Wake up man.
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Adam Helmsing 7 months ago
um....overated how that, last time i checked he leads a couple of major passing cat. for quarterbacks in thier careers, you dont get those records or a first class ticket to the hall of fame by being overrated. yeah he lost us some games, sure he threw alot of interception, well he never missed a game and he has more touchdowns then anyother qb so reckless..yes, overrated no
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
His recklessness lead to his being overrated. Again, not trying to take anything away from the man. He is just not as good as you think he is. And you're probably a Packers fan, and you seem to be slightly biased.
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jeff ircink 7 months ago
Ok cy young had most wins. you know what i mean.
and ruth HAD the most HR and strikeouts.
quit being a punk. your article is as worthless and the 1000 other articles on the same subject.
how about a psychological article on the need for people to rehash tired, old subjects - like this one.
but GOOD TRY anyway, master brynn.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
sure go ahead and write it. I'd like to see what good writing looks like. Maybe I'll click into your archive and entertain myself for a while.
If you disagree with my article, fine. Don't call me a punk because I corrected one of your mistakes. If you're going to debate sports, try to know what you're talking about. If you get a fact wrong, I will correct you.
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thomas moreland 7 months ago
hers the real truth!!!! green bay has basically the same team that was 13-3 last year w favre. now they are 5-5 with rodgers. farve is taking the jets to the play offs, he makes anyt team better and i would take him as my q/b in any play off game and hope the team performs! the team !!!! team team team team team. figure it out! any idiot knows favre is a class act and not overrated. green bay should have finished his contact for 2 more yrs. the people that think he s overrated and the grreen bay front office are morons! more negative comments about this article than i can count. fugiure it out! punk was a good choice of words from one comment! lol
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Michael Inglis 7 months ago
Green Bay isn't playing defense this year and Ryan Grant is a one year wonder. That's why they are 5-5. Rodgers has a better QB rating this year anyways.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
To everyone who disagrees with this article, see if you can respond non-aggressively. I'm not a punk and I'm allowed to disagree. That's why I love sports, because not everybody agrees. I'm not a Bears fan or a Lions fan or a Vikings fan or a Packers hater or anything. I'm an Eagles fan. I don't hate Brett Favre and I don't care if he does charity work or has fun playing the game because that's not relevant. I personally feel that Brett Favre is overrated.
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Eric Ecir 7 months ago
McNabb is overrated. 0 Super Bowl rings, injury plagued career, etc.
McNabb 2008 Stats 13 TD, 5 INT, 2,372 Yds, Passing Rating at 90.7%.
Favre 2008 Stats 18 TD, 12 INT, 2,237 Yds, Passing Rating at 93.0%.
And that is without McNabb's 3 INT's today (so far). He is 8 years younger. Are you writing about the wrong QB? At 39 McNabb will have been retired for 5 years and making appearances signing autographs for fools like you to pay for.
Why don't you go out and get a job flipping burgers and do something you might be good at?
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
I agree. McNabb is overrated. Could you do me one favor please? Tell me why that is relevant. This article was about Brett Favre.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Passer rating is not a percentage. It's not out of 100. And this article is not about 2008. Again, I ask that you don't comment if you don't know football.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Read my last article. I ripped McNabb to shreds.
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Eric Ecir 7 months ago
RedSox, a Favre hater himself, comes in here to defend this trash. The bleacher report is bombarded by anti-Favre stories all too often. The fact is this, people who write them have absolutely no credibility. 75% of the time, the author is writing the piece as tears run down their cheeks onto their Bears or Vikings jersey, and the other 25% of the time it is a Tom Brady fan who cries that their hero is sipping margaritas on a beach while their team's prospects are not as good as they once were.
Get a life, you pricks. Your obsession with Brett Favre is unhealthy.
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Michael Inglis 7 months ago
Seems like you have a little man crush on Favre.
Sorry to tell you, he's married.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Why does someone who writes an anti-Favre story have no credibility? People are allowed to not like the man. I don't dislike him, I just think he is overrated.
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jeff ircink 7 months ago
the McNabb mention IS relevant if you write an article rating a particular QB (Favre) against all other QBs. that's why this subject if overdone and a mute point. you open a can of worms that doesn't have a finite answer, bryanna - i mean bryan - a can of worms that's been open in a thousand other articles, thus making this article a regurgitation.
why don't you write about the % that a prevent defense works in a team's favor compared to when it hinders a team. THAT would be enlightening and a subject that hasn't received the coverage nearly as much as this one.
by the way, bryan, i do applaud the fact that you WROTE an article and that it's getting a lot of looksee's by people. not unlike many of the articles you see on, let's say, FoxSports.com.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
It's Bryn bud, and maybe I will write that prevent defense article but you do know that Brett Favre doesn't play defense right? So I'm sorry, but I won't be able to give him credit for interceptions made by the Baltimore Ravens or Seattle Seahawks. I'll see if I can make it so the Packers come in first and the Jets second.
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Jim Schultz 7 months ago
overrate (v.) To overestimate the merits of; rate too highly.
merit (n.) Superior quality or worth; excellence
You've found a way to belittle every thing that Favre did that wasn't up to your standards. All of the records he holds sound as though they are something anybody could do. Your ignorance is magnified when you said you didn't care if both of my arms fell off. We too have the right to have a point of view and frankly it seems you are in the minority on nearly every so called point you've made. Just because it's not clear to you, doesn't make it wrong. It may just mean you have no idea what's being said. Every point that has been brought up is "not relevant". I'm not going to tell you records or positive things about the man because your highness would deem it not relevant. So, I get it, you wrote the piece and only you can make the rules on what can be called important. I just wonder why people were getting aggressive with you. Call a man wrong enough times, without valid reason and eventually someone's gonna want to verbally assault you. Also, don't even come off with the coward excuse "I'm not a Favre hater", that's purely crap. That my friend is very relevant to your story.
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Matt Schaefer 7 months ago
Agree.
What you have done was taken an article for debate but when it starts to turn to the debate you wanted all you say is "QB X is not relevant" and I dont care that Favre was one of the toughest players to play the game he throws a lot of picks. He holds the records for most INTs yes and that is with his length in the game and how he plays it. Does he lose some games for his teams, yes but he also wins some too. The guy has also one some games too with his grit and leadership (take a look at the thursday night game if you want an example).
He ALSO owns the career records for starts in a row, TDs, Completions, etc. He is one of the greatest QBs to play the game and him holding the record shows it. Just because he doesnt play mistake free all the time doesnt mean he is overrated. Everyone makes mistakes, it is what humans do.
The person he is also does help too. He has battled through problems with his father dieing, wife with breat cancer, i believe it was a cousin who died on an ATV on his lot of land, going to rehab, almost dieing in a car accident, the list goes on and on. But hey that doesnt matter to you either.
He has HELPED take a Jets team from being one of the worst in the AFC to one of the best in one year. I say help because you win and lose games as a TEAM not just one player.
Favre is not an overrated QB. He might get too much exposure in the national media (especially this offseason) but that doesnt take away from his work on the field.
And I know you will proabably bring it up so Ill just state it right here, if a guy who can still play the game wants to play, that is fine. Sure Brett might not have handled it the right way but if he can still go, then let him. Would you quit a job you love because you felt pressured out of it, or pushed away by your employer? No i dont think so, you would want to do the thing you loved for as long as you can.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Jim, you've commented like six times and you haven't changed my mind, so what are you still fighting for? I can imagine what it was like to see the man that took your team from a mediocre franchise in the 1970s and 1980s to a superstar team in the 1990s and a good team in the 2000s being verbally criticized. I would be upset also but open your eyes to the potential that Favre may be slightly overrated.
If I were a Favre hater, I would be the first person to admit it but I'm not. I just hate the fact that he is given continuous passes for his inability to succeed in the clutch, while other quarterbacks are ripped to shreds year after year. For example, I hate this man, absolutely hate him, but Tony Romo. There's someone who is overcriticized. That's coming from an Eagles fan. People are never going to let him forget his last-minute postseason collapses in 2006 and 2007. But how can people just ignore Favre's postseason failures, year after year after year? Every year, it's just ignored.
What confuses me is everyone that acts like overrated is the harshest word ever. It's not that bad....I claim that he is a top ten quarterback of all time. Honestly, what do you want? Where should he be ranked? Is he #1 or #2? Most lists I see put him at 5 or 6. Why is 8 or 9 so ridiculous?
A decent amount of quarterbacks were overrated in my opinion. Terry Bradshaw and Troy Aikman and John Elway. And Brett Favre. I picked Favre to write this article about because he is the most recent. Plus there's no way I could write one about Aikman without being accused of being biased, which I probably would be. But biased towards Brett Favre? No reason to hate the guy.
Do you really think that everybody out there is going to agree with you? Is Jim the right one in the world? I'm not calling your arguments wrong. I just tell you I disagree with you.
I think it will be interesting to see how people react when Peyton Manning breaks every one of Favre's career passing records.
If football games are won and lost as a team, which they are, then the most important job of a quarterback is to put his team in position to win games by not turning the ball over. Rex Grossman turns the ball over less than Brett Favre. You gotta admit that's a jaw-dropping statistic. Defend Favre on that one.
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jeff ircink 7 months ago
i didn't say Brett had anything to do with a prevent defense - just a different article topic to right on.
and before you blankly state Brett "might not" have handled the Packer divorce the right way, do your research. Packer management had a hand in "not handling it the right way either". i've written a TON on this in my blog if you want an objective look.
but that's another topic - and one that has been written about ad nauseum as well.
PS. bryn you stated, "Would you quit a job you love because you felt pressured out of it, or pushed away by your employer?"
how can you put yourself in Favre's mind to argue what he was thinking and why he did what he did? ridiculous. don't even go there. and....i think....he came back and is playing so it's a mute point anyway.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
I don't understand. When did I ever say anything about the Packer divorce? Where did I write that? Would you please find it for me?
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Jeff, again, listen.
"Would you quit a job you love because you felt pressured out of it, or pushed away by your employer?"
Matt wrote that. Scroll up. See where he responded to your comment. He wrote that.
When I wrote my article, I didn't address Brett Favre'd divorce from the Packers or his current tenure with the Jets. I also didn't address the possibility of quitting or not quitting professional football.
I focus on the facts, not Favre's feelings.
Where and why do you keep coming up with this stuff that I clearly never said?
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Matt Schaefer 7 months ago
i can put myself in favre shoes because that is what he said. for example in his press confrence that he retired. a grown man was crying over a game that he loved to play because (well atleast at that point) he was going to give it up. he even admitted that he still had the physical skills to play the game but the heart just wasnt there anymore.
that is how you can put yourself in his shoes, when he comes out and says it.
and the point of favre playing is not the mute point seeing as he eventually came back to the game he loved.
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jeff ircink 7 months ago
and you can all put this in your McNabb file (as i heard it on ESPN after the game) -
McNabb was seemingly unaware that an NFL game can end in OT. ??????????
his quote. THEN he went on to say he'd like to see how an OT game in the NFL would play
out in the playoffs or SB. ?????????????
are you eff'in kiddin' me???????????
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
"Does Donovan McNabb Really Fail In the Clutch?"
An article I wrote a couple of days ago. I said he does. Yes, I criticized my own quarterback. This was a day after I ripped Andy Reid to shreds.
Please stop accusing me of being blind. My McNabb file is in a separate category from my Brett Favre file.
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jeff ircink 7 months ago
...and it didn't sound like he was joking (from my perspective and the radio annoucer's).
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David Arreola 7 months ago
Since I actually have time, I think I'm going to point out your bias points.
1) Avoided future criticism by winning a Super Bowl early in his career? Do you think he was thinking "whew, now I don't have to worry about that" after he won the game? Hell no, he was excited about the championship. Only a true Favre-hater would try to make a SUPER BOWL CHAMPIONSHIP look bad.
2) I love how you briefly mention Favre's impressive record of 35-0 in temperatures below 34 degrees and go straight to the criticism. Ryan Longwell missed two FG's, a punt was blocked and Sherman made a terrible call to go for it on 4th down that backfired as the Packers were stopped. Yes Favre threw 2 picks that costed his team dearly...you cannot pin the loss completely on Favre. because if those 3 FG's go in and the punt is not blocked you have a 20-16 score. I'll take Favre in the fourth quarter with that.
3) 2003 wild card, thanks to Al Harris? So I guess its time to say Brady's Super Bowls were thanks to Adam Vinatieri?
4) 2003 divisional, 4th & 26 is all I am going to say. Do not lie to me you knew the game was over before McNabb made that outstanding throw.
5) Favre threw 158 more TD's than INTs. The only quarterbacks that can boast a higher differential is Peyton Manning and Dan Marino. Pretty good company huh? Better than Montana, Young, Elway, Bradshaw and Unitas.
6) Peyton Manning choked in the playoffs early in his career and is only 7-7 in the playoffs. Yet you still rank him higher than Favre?
Fact of the matter is you are biased and this article is biased.
You did mention Favre's accomplishments...but made them sound like every quarterback can do it! You severly underappreciate his accomplishments while magnifying his mistakes.
You have to see it from both fences. Favre has done more good than bad. A winning post-season and regular season record. Owns virtually all the regular season passing records (yes including the INT one, but as I stated before he has a higher differential than most "great" quarterbacks). He is within reach of Montana's playoff records.
Perhaps I can't convice you, but you at least must surrender this fact.
Brett Favre is the most prolific quarterback in NFL history. His numbers do not lie.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
About time. This is what I'm looking for. Ok, here you go.
1) I think you might have misunderstood this one. Under no fault of Brett Favre's, his Super Bowl win came early in his career. You know how everyone got all on Peyton Manning because he never won a Super Bowl? This never happened to Favre because he won it early. If Favre didn't win it till 2004 (say you switched the results of the 96 and 04 postseason), people would have been merciless on him. They weren't though because he won it in 96. And this led to people ignoring his future failures in the playoffs, because he had already won it all, while Manning (2003, 2004) was ripped to shreds because he never won it all. Again, no fault of Favre, but it did lead to him being overrated.
2) The Atlanta game was a complete disaster for the entire team. 27-7. That's unbelievable. I credit the Packers for never losing a game at home in the playoffs before this game, but just like you mention that he holds all the team records and is the greatest quarterback in GB history, I mention that he was now QB for the first Packer team to lose at home in the playoffs.
3) 2003 wild-card not all Al Harris. When I said thanks to Al Harris, I meant that's how it ended--with Al Harris winning it in overtime. Favre played well that game. 316 yards, 1 touchdown and 0 interceptions I think, right? Good game.
4) 2003 divisional--bad play by defense. But again, Favre had a chance to bring his team back. They got the ball in overtime. I honestly would like to know what he was thinking on that play where he just heaved it up. Have you ever seen a worse pass? Maybe if it was a normal interception, I could let it go. The Eagles were definitely the better team. But on a play like that, in a situation that big, I can't just let it go. As a Packer fan, did you just blame the whole game on the defense? The defense that gave up 20 points to a good Eagle offense?
5) Favre threw 158 more touchdowns than interceptions. Nobody is higher in that sense. However.....listen to me. The ratio is way way way more important. TD-to-INT ratio. For example, Steve Young (230-107) is 2.14, Tom Brady (197-86) 2.29, Joe Montana (273-139) 1.96, Donovan McNabb (185-87) 2.12. Lots and lots of quarterbacks are better. Favre is below average on the amount of interceptions he throws.
6) As of now, Peyton or Favre? Probably Favre. By the end of their careers? I think Peyton.
Again, I say for the thousandth time that I acknowledge Favre as a top ten quarterback. What do you want? I would like you to answer that one this time, as well as some of my comments from earlier.
He is within reach of Montana's playoff record, but hasn't won 4 Super Bowls, including 3 MVPs. Please don't tell me you think Favre is better than Montana.
Brett Favre might be the most prolific quarterback in NFL history. That is precisely why I feel that he is overrated. I feel that someone with 458 touchdown passes and all those amazing stats should have been able to perform better in the playoffs. I honestly would expect more than 1 Super Bowl ring out of him. 33 turnovers in 22 playoff games? That's sick.
Your turn.
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David Arreola 7 months ago
Actually I do blame the loss on the Packers defense. You get paid millions of dollars to make those plays. 4th and 26? You are kidding me. I was already planning my trip to Carolina. Favre has answered questions about the throw. He said he was under pressure and saw out of the corner of his eye Javon Walker running a streak. He threw it and Javon quit on the route. Should he have thrown it? Hell no, but it wasn't as bad a throw as some people think.
The interceptions are bad, I will not deny that. However, I have stated before that without Favre's shoot first think later mentality has sometimes allowed him to create those amazing memorable plays. However, we must take the bad that comes with it. I would prefer him to not throw across the field or into double coverage...but he's the future HOF quarterback not me.
I do not think Favre is a better passer than Montana. But I think Favre has more talent. No doubt Montana is better in big games, nobody was bigger than him. I did state in my article, what if Favre had been given a HOF receiver his entire career? I think things would have been different.
You give the playoffs FAR too much value. In that case John Elway, Dan Marino, Fran Tarkenton, and Jim Kelly were all overrated quarterbacks. Uhhh, most definately not.
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Michael Inglis 7 months ago
Can you name me anything Favre has done since the turn of the century.
And stop throwing out these woulda, coulda, shoulda scenerios.
For instance, Longwell missing FG, McNabb's play, and a bad coaching call. Every great QB in NFL history deals with those very same situations. Some win despite them so don't. It still doesn't change that fact that Favre threw two of the most heinous INT in playoff history that you'll every see.
Personally I think Favre is a great QB (the author agrees) but I think he's a bit overrated. Overrated because he's only won one SB and that was over 10 years ago. I also think he cost his team games sometimes with dumb decisisions.
But overall I would only call him overrated because of the way he media treats him. He is a tell all book and the media LOVES that. They eat that crap up like birthday cake. Think back to last summer when Favre mannia hit the U.S., they acted like this man was the best thing since Jesus Christ. And the media never talks about him in a negative light, even after some horrible postseason performances.
He's a great QB, but only overrated because the media portrays him like a God.
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David Arreola 7 months ago
Michael, have you lived under a Favre-hating shield all summer?
The media have crucified Favre over the summer. Words like "tarnished legacy", "selfish", "flip-flopper" have been thrown around, JUST TO NAME A FEW.
So shut up if you don't know what you are talking about. They love Favre because he is a lovable guy. If you honestly think Favre's attitude and behavior is not admirable, then you must be either a saint or jesus christ, in which case get the hell off B/R and start saving lives.
Yeah, Favre's pick was nasty. I admit that...I admit he makes mistakes. he has costed the Packers in the past. Yet he has also won games for us. As long as he keeps bringing more good than bad, they will let him play in New York.
A Super Bowl that was won 10 years ago doesn't count as a Super Bowl won last year? Ok so that means Montana's Super Bowls don't mean a thing compared to Eli Manning's win! Or how about Jeff Hostetler!
I can name you a few things Favre has done since the turn of the century.
1) More wins than any QB in NFL history
2) More yards than any QB in NFL history
3) More TD's than any QB in NFL history
4) 263 consecutive starts, only 7 away from the NFL record at ANY position.
5) led the NFL in passing TD's in 2003
6) has passed for over 4,000 yards twice. 2004+2007. Came within 200 yards of 4,000 4 other times.
7) Has had a QB rating above 90 4 times.
8) went to an NFC championship game
You guys are the people that would forget Otto Graham and Johnny Unitas because they played so long ago. Favre's accomplishments in the 90's were great and CANNOT be overlooked because of a few bad seasons. It would be the same if he had played awful in the 90's and he has just started to boom.
If we go by today, yes Manning and Brady are better. Throw their careers together, I'd take Favre in a heartbeat.
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Bryn Swartz 7 months ago
Jeff, records like passing yards and touchdowns and whatever weren't done after the new millennium. That's when the records were set. I understand what you're saying, but it takes a lifetime to set those records. But Brett Favre hasn't been incredible. He has had a rating above 90 four times and has led the league in three passing categories. That's not unbelievable. Steve Young led the NFL in passer rating six times. His career rating was over 96. Favre had that like what twice?
Stay off the topic off Brett Favre's behavior.
And I know who Otto Graham is. 10 years, 1946-1955, 10 championship games, 7 wins.
Johnny U, 47 straight games with a touchdown pass, 1958 NFL championship game....
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