"Detroit’s window has closed. Detroit’s too old. Detroit’s not hungry enough. Detroit’s too predictable."
I have been hearing these arguments for three years now, and I still fail to understand how people across the league consistently count the Detroit Pistons out of the championship talk, year after year, despite overwhelming success and an incredibly well-constructed team. This is my first article, and I hope it is strong enough to help answer some questions people may be having about the ’09 NBA Championship.
I hear these arguments every year and hold the people who make them in the highest respect, as everybody is entitled to their opinion and the reasons for the development of said opinion, especially seeing how the Pistons did eventually falter in the end.
However, this is one year where I cannot even begin to agree with any negative talk about how far this Pistons team will go in 2009. This team has the potential to be an even greater team than 2004, and the last few teams they have had did possess the capability of bringing home the trophy.
This year, like ’04, belongs to Detroit.
Sure, there are plenty of other contenders out there, but how many with the defensive capabilities, coupled with the offensive arsenal, of the Detroit Pistons. This year, it is not going to come down to individual accomplishment. It will come down to the compilation of straight skills and oddities that are quite difficult to predict or prepare for.
Take the main unit of the four consistent starters, along with the flavor of the week at power forward or center. Tayshaun Prince is the most underrated small forward in the game, with his ridiculously long wingspan and recently developed ability to cut to the basket.
Currently boasting a breakout year, Prince has been put in charge of running the offense many times, and is expected to hold a large role as point forward, which is dangerous for other teams due to his odd array of abilities and great basketball intelligence.
A team with this type of offense is more difficult to defend, because defenses are built to stop a traditional point guard, a position which can be quite predictable at times, even for the great point guards of the league like Chris Paul.
Allen Iverson has a game unseen in the league before him, with a nearly unstoppable crossover and ability to draw defenders in groups, leaving open other good shooters. It is true that he is more of a shoot-first, pass-later type of point guard, but with Prince’s ability to run an offense from the 3 position, this will not be much of an issue in time.
His backcourt mate, Richard Hamilton, is still the best in the league at moving without the basketball, and even though his timing is off so far this year, when his game is on, Rip is quite dangerous.
Few teams in the league have a player with his ability to catch and shoot almost simultaneously, which decreases the effectiveness of the shot clock on your team’s offense.
Rasheed Wallace, when his game is on, is arguably the best player in the league. He can shoot from downtown with great success, but his true magic comes from when he is actually motivated enough to play down in the post.
His passing abilities, as well as his on-court awareness, add more of a threat for any defender to worry about, but when he posts up with the ball in his hands, nobody (including Tim Duncan and Kevin Garnett) has the ability to stop him, at which point you may just want to count the bucket before he even shoots.
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about 1 month ago
We'll only go as far as Sheed will take us. If he wants to win another title, we will. 21 points 15 reb so far this year. You might think this is impulsive, or crazy comment but it's entirely true. We NEED him on board- at all times.
from about 1 month ago
It's not even totally about just his skill. His emotional strength is so effective that when he is on, the rest of the team plays better. I agree with you that as Rasheed goes, so go the Pistons.
about 1 month ago
Iverson is good, but Billups has made the Nuggets into contenders again in the west. The age of the Pistons will show itself, especially toward the end of the season when younger teams like the Magic, Cavs, and Raps will simply outplay.
I give them a chance in the Eastern Conference (the C's seem vulnerable, they can hold their own against the Cavs) but no way they win the title. The Lakers are too strong to lose to the Pistons.
Also, how is Tayshaun Prince underrated? Everyone loves him, he was on the olympic team, etc.
from about 1 month ago
Billups has definitely made Nuggets better, but I don't know if I would be ready to call them contenders in the west. They are at least 5 teams that are much better than them if they can stay healthy. As far as in the east, AI does seem to have revived this stagnant franchise, but lets see how long that's going to last. Pistons are still the second best team in the east, with or without Billups in the lineup. They do have good young talent on this team, but getting past the C's will be difficult part, regardless of how much yapping they do.
from about 1 month ago
Im sorry...but Nuggets fans are getting a little too excited. I know I have to excuse some of you because you folks wouldnt know what real contenders are, considering that franchise has been 1 and done in the playoffs for years now, even before Iverson came. That franchise basically traded away their PG (Miller) for Iverson, a combo gaurd (without ever really addressing the backcourt issue), just to turn back around and trade off Iverson for another PG. They basically are back to being the same team they were before the Iverson trade..only now they dont even have Camby. As mentioned, there are about 5 or 6 better teams in the West over the Nuggets. The Nuggets are 7-1 since they got Billups..but the only team they have played in all those games with a winning record was Boston. Im not saying Billups hasnt helped and wont continue to be a nice addition to that team, but that team is atill not a serious contender..they still have a ways to go. They are a more rounded even team, but thats about it. The fact that that franchise was 1 and done in the playoffs for three strait years before Iverson and was one and done with him...is more of a reflection on that franchise then it is on Iverson. After a while you have to start looking at the constants on all those teams that havent made it out the first round (Coach Karl and Carmelo)...no more excuses.
Also, the Pistons actually have a good mixture of veterens and youth. And im not sure if you've noticed but I dont even remember the last time a 'young team' has won a title. You usually have teams that are a mixture. Its been the veteren teams that have been the most consistant and dominate over the last decade. If age doesnt slow Boston down, then why would it slow Detroit? I understand teams will evolve...but some fans seem obsessed with age.
from about 1 month ago
Uh, I'm not a Nuggets fan. But Billups has helped them a lot. They've beaten the Spurs, the Cs, and Mavs. Even if only one of them is over 500 they're all good teams.
from about 1 month ago
Sam...you know good and well that the Mavs arent a good team this season and the Spurs are beyond injured right now. The win against Boston was a good win though. And yes, Chauncy has helped them be more balanced and help that undisciplined offense, but they won 50 games last season as well. But you said the Nuggets were contenders..and I sort of felt the need to chime in on that because that was just sort of funny, especially only after only two weeks in the season.
from about 1 month ago
Billups has added an element to the Nuggets that they have not recently had, and this element is a player who has the presence of mind to put the ball into places where players just cannot miss. Billups cannot do it himself, so he has no choice but to trust his teammates. They problem with this is that a strategy of creating plays for non-skilled players will fail to succeed in the playoffs. Great players elevate their games at this time, but the most Billups can do is continue to get mediocre players better shots. A mediocre player will not immediately become better.
Iverson gives the Pistons something they do not have yet, and that is a go-to scorer. Tayshaun can run the ball very well, and Stuckey is learning to run the offense. Billups has been overly excited as of late to shoot the ball at the wrong times. Examples of this include times when he would be on a breakaway, but stop and fire up a triple even though he had a direct line to the basket with no defenders in his way. Iverson may sometimes take bad shots, but they are usually in areas that are well defended with no openings. His game will adapt to Detroit's in time, but Billups is too slow to adapt to Denver's. They will have to adapt to him, and one player adapting to a team is much more easily done than an entire team adapting to a player.
about 1 month ago
I just hope you are right. I would love to see anyone in the east except the Celtics to go to the finals.
they have no class up there. All they do is trash talk other teams as if winning a title does'nt put a target on your back already. They're going to get into a big fight this season at some point because of all the talking they do. And most of it is not done by the big3, its the role players that rode the coat tails of PP,KG & RA. RESPECT THE GAME & RESPECT YOUR OPPONENT.
from about 1 month ago
Totally agree with you on the respect issue Tony, exactly what most should think, but most do not.
And i hope that Rip Hamilton finds himself again soon, eventually teams will be able to find a way to stop Wallace (or he'll stop himself, either through lack of motivation or tech's etc) so it will come down to Hamilton to have a big game or two in the playoffs. And for Sam's comment, Tayshaun never has been an all-star?
from about 1 month ago
Hey man, when you win, you can talk all the trash you want. You earn it. That's how it works.
They respect the game, you cannot even begin to tell me that they don't. If you think Kevin Garnett doesn't respect basketball, then you don't know Kevin Garnett.
The Celtics are the class of the NBA, just as Montreal is the class of the NHL and the Yankees are the class of MLB.
about 1 month ago
People have been talking about Detroit being out of contention year after year? Don't you mean talk this one (singular) year? Because from what I recall the vast majority of analysts/NBA fans had automatically put Detroit amongst the very best of the league since even before their championship.
This was the first year where there's been widespread talk about a down turn, and the arguments are relatively valid. Getting Iverson was in no way a move to win a championship. He's an awesome player, no doubt, but he's never been able to lead a contender (even with Carmelo and Camby). The move is purely a salary dump, albeit a stupid one. Iverson only has 1 year left, which means Detroit's freeing up max money for a year where no max money guys are going to be available. You can always sign Iverson again, but he won't do it for much less and a long contract. What this all means is Detroit management has painted themselves out of the 2010 free agent feeding frenzy, leaving Iverson to be their only legitimate potential signee.
And even the most ardent Detroit fan has to agree - Billups makes teams better than Iverson does. Case in point?
Detroit with Billups : 4-0. With Iverson : 4-3.
Denver with Iverson : 1-3. With Billups : 6-1.
Iverson. and the bone headed management involved in the trade, is the very reason Detroit isn't going to contend for the title this year or the foreseeable future. Rasheed doesn't like the trade, and at times you can tell when he's left standing around while Iverson goes for a shot Billups would usually kick back out. Plus, saying Rasheed Wallace could be the best player in the league if he tries is like saying Vince Carter could create any shot he wants if only he wasn't a p***y.
from about 1 month ago
Iverson has never been able to lead a contender? I guess his trip to the 2001 Finals was just a figment of imagination. Oh well. Again...the Nuggets were NOT contenders even with Iverson...they were a fun team to watch, but that team lacked heart..a true PG..and a Coach (because Karl was a mess half the time). It was a waste of Iversons time and a waste of a talented team on Coach Karls part.
Joe Dumars has said himself that dispite what media outlets keep saying, that getting Iverson was his first priority and having salary relief was just the icing on the cake. He said he would have not traded Chauncey for any player less then Iverson and that he wants to look at Iversons development with this team to see where they go from there. I think i'll take Dumars word for what he's trying to do over fans and some media outlets. If Sheed and Iverson both come off the books next season, that is over 30 million dollars of cap relief, so I dont see how its a stupid move. If Iverson is as serious as he claims to be about wanting to contend untill he retires, then why wouldnt he resign with Detroit a few more seasons at a discount just to stay with a good team untill retirement? Iverson already has a ton of money, he wouldnt be missing much..and even then judging by who all they keep, they could still have enough to go after another free agent. To me, from a money point of view..Denver is the one that doesnt seem to make any since when it comes to this trade. They traded off Camby for peanuts just to dump salary..they turned around and traded off Iverson (an expiring) and took more money on their books..so they are basically stuck with this team for years to come...and if they still dont at least get out the first round then what?
Billups is a true PG...Iverson is not, so naturally it takes more time when you insert a player of Iversons dynamic on a team that has had a certain chemistry for 6 years, all the while with a new Coach and new system. Its easier to fit a player like Chauncey in because he is sort of a prototype player (and the Nuggets switch players in and out more then any team I know), Iverson is not. Detroits system does fit better for a player like Iverson then Denvers does though. Like I mentioned before, the Nuggets have probably had one of the more easier schedules in all the NBA, the only team they have played with a winning record was Boston. While I beleive Detroit has played the Lakers, Celtics (twice), Suns and CAVS all in the past two weeks..the majority of their games on the road all while trying to adjust to a new player who is more dominate then Chauncey. By the way, that one game that you mentioned that Denver had won with Iverson..they won because of him, the other two Carmelo didnt even play because he was suspended. And Chauncy was 2-0 with the Pistons..they won 2 without him before Iverson even got there. Rasheed Wallace has been one of the biggest beneficiaries when it has come to Iverson, he has been playing as if he had a light up his butt since Iversons arrival..him and Sheeds pick and rolls with those 3- pointers have been killer. Sheed and Tayshawn Prince have benefited the most. Rip is probably the one that still has to get used to it. But I beleive Sheed and Iverson have been friends off the court for years, so I dont see where you are coming from saying "Sheed doesnt like the trade". Iverson isnt a perfect player, no player is..but fans like yourself are hilarious when you go out your way to state an opinion without all the facts.
from about 1 month ago
I think Iverson gives Detroit a different dimension, sure he is no playmaker and lacks the leadership of Billups. But he gives Detroit what they have been missing, a go-to scorer who can take it to a different level. Sure they have 'Sheed and Rip but neither of them have the high octane level to go on a duel with LBJ, Kobe or PP. Dumars have previously lamented that the Pistons do not have a superstar, someone on a different level and in AI they have their answer. He gives the Pistons a talismanic type of player that could turn things around........
about 1 month ago
AI gives the Pistons a lot more flexibility on the offensive end. He is still a handful off the dribble and once he is in the paint good things usually happen. The greatest beneficiary of AI's arrival has to be the "Prince of the Palace." This kid has been mercilessly attacked by the sports pundits in the motor city for his lack of production. He is an Olympian, he has great length; always seems to be matched up against the opponents best offensive player and has never once stirred the pot on a team with "knucklehead" Wallace around.
The overall basketball IQ of this team is much higher than it was a year ago. Credit new coack Micheal Curry for allowing each of his players strengths to be showcased ina team concept.
Defense wins championships and unless they can lock down on the big three of the Celtics, they will be on the sidelines again. Boston has a hungry, no-nonsense attitude each time they take the floor thanks to the veteran leadership of the Big Three. They are for real; they proved it last year and will do it again this year.
IA returning to the Eastern Conference has made the one almight West not so almighty. Time will tell how well they will gel with AI and if they can avoid the injury bug. Right now, the Pistons probably have one of the top three starting lineups in the league. If they stay healthy, they will be in the hunt for th big dance.
about 1 month ago
Detroit has never been doubted as a championship contender. Where you get that sentiment is beyond me.
The criticisms levied against the Pistons have been well-deserved. Joe Dumars did not construct the team so it could reach the conference finals each year. He wants the Pistons to win that series and then the championship.
The Eastern Conference has been so week that the Pistons have been good and solid enough to coast through the season. If you have the time or the interest, I can post many examples of this, and they are not isolated incidents. Arrogance has been a part of this team, and while many take that as an insult or a jab, it isn't.
I also wouldn't call it a compliment. How else do you explain the Pistons losing twice in a row to inferior teams in the conference finals (Miami and Cleveland) and letting the young Sixers steal two games in that opening series last season?
They are good enough to beat most teams with that attitude but against teams with comparable talent and greater hunger, it sinks them. I respect them for being good enough to win 50 games and two playoff series without a player regarded at the superstar level.
The Pistons have reached six straight Eastern Conference Finals and won two of them. Losing three of those in a row counts for a lot. Again, the goal is not just to get there, but to win it and also the championship.
As for your poll question, the answer to me is obvious: Rasheed Wallace. He has decided thus far this season to abandon his post game and become a streaky jumpshooter. When the shots fall, it busts open the lane for penetration by Iverson and Stuckey. When they don't, the Pistons have no interior scoring, save what Brown can give them off the bench, and that makes them as mortal as any jumpshooting squad in the NBA.
The Iverson-Billups swap seems to be working for both teams, but the Pistons will miss Chauncey's ability to defend virtually any point guard and also his post up game.
If Wallace reverted back to how he played in 2004 and 2005, when he utilized his wealth of post and perimeter skills, this team could be dangerous enough to make a return trip to the Finals.
about 1 month ago
I think the Cavs are a force to be reckoned with, and the Celtics are only going to get better. I can't get over the fact that the Celts are 10-2 despite playing terribly offensively. They will get things together on offense, mark my words.
Another thing about the Cavs- they'll probably make an in-season move because they need to win now, and they know that.
I think the Pistons are contenders, but 2-4 in the last 6 Eastern Conference Finals is less than spectacular.
The Celtics are the champs, and until Detroit proves they can hang with the champs, the Celts have to be the favorites.
about 1 month ago
truly spoken like a true Piston fan who might be blinded by his fandom.
by the way i am a Pistons fan too, all Detroit sports actually.
and i think the Pistons have a chance of getting back to the Finals, certainly. It is way too early in the season to conclude that one way or another however.
But my friend, I hope you watched the Detroit Pistons/Boston Celtics game tonight. You want to know why people think they might just get back to the EC Finals again, but just fall short of the finals? Because there is a team called the Boston Celtics out there who are just currently better.
Heck, even the Cavaliers game last night was close until the fourth, and the Pistons showed signs of being an inconsistent basketball team.
They are a work in progress right now. They have potential. But if you watched the Celts game tonight, there is no way you could logically argue that they deserve the kind of respect the Celts do. Even the Lakers, even though they beat them.
Right now they are what they are; an 8-4 team. They are finding an identity. They have a superstar now true.
But Rip needs to find his way again. Rasheed needs to play consistent on both ends. Stuckey has a lot of learning to do (he can't just drive uncontrollably to the basket time after time). And if you want Prince being the go-to-guy...well, I think the Pistons are in trouble. He can be that sometimes, but game after game? Oh boy.
It's a long season. Time will tell. But RIGHT NOW, is not a time to make any sort of proclamation that the Pistons will be there. They don't deserve it.
from about 1 month ago
Well, I do have to wonder what you refer to as proof that the Celtics are overall better. After all, their schedule so far has been extremely easy. 8 of their games have been at home. Both games against Detroit have been against teams that were off, including one game where they had just aquired Iverson and were preparing for their first West Coast trip, and the second with Detroit playing on the road again after a tough game with Cleveland. Of their 4 away games, one was against a Detroit team with a recent facelift, a weak Oklahoma City team, and two very close games against Milwaukee and Houston, two good but not great teams.
Their two losses came at the hands of a Denver Nuggets team that was on the road and still establishing its new identity, and a pathetic Indiana Pacers team, which beat them by 16.
I agree with you that Boston is a very good team, but it will take a more forgiving stretch for the Pistons, and a harsher one for the Celtics before we can really see how it's going to pan out. I intend to write another article to re-evaluate after this upcoming home stretch.
from about 1 month ago
But the Celtics have essentially the same team as last year, minus Posey, and that team proved they can handle tough stretches. The swept the 3 Texas teams in four nights on the road last year, and they played 26 games in the playoffs against one hot team (Atlanta) and three great teams (Cleveland, Detroit, LA).
Denver has gone 7-1 with Billups playing, so there's no way that's a bad loss for Boston.
about 1 month ago
Pistons would not make the playoffs if they were a west team. Iverson was somewhat overmatched in our conference, he will probably lead you deep in to the playoffs though. Have fun with another nice playoff run this year piston fan, just know that your conference is the jv to our varsity.
from about 1 month ago
well that is just an asinine statement considering entering tonight the East held 4 of the 5 best records in the NBA. So far the East is dominating the West head-to-head, and the best two teams in the East the past two years have winning records against the West consistently (Det and Boston).
Nice try though, really.
from about 1 month ago
Wait, anthony. How did you win that argument?
Last year the east only had 3 teams with a winning record against the west, while the west had 10 with winning records against the east.
Not to mention that the west has won 6 of the 9 championships this decade and 5 of 9 all star games.
There is no possible way for you to prove that the east is better.
Don't give me a stupid answer this time dude.
from about 1 month ago
Well, Nathan...while your argument is valid, to a point, you cannot use the record of finals victories to determine which side is better. After all, with the exception of Detroit, the East teams tend to overachieve in the playoffs, while the West teams tend to collapse. Need I remind you of the 2-0 lead that Dallas squandered against Miami. Also, your 6 of 9 theory would be more relevant if it referred to a cluster of teams, when it fact it refers to 2 great teams, one of which was incredibly dominant for 3 straight years in an era where the entire NBA was at a weak point, and the other of which keeps tending to come back and win every other year, due to their immense skill. However, the East has had 3 different victors in that time. In fact, in the past 5 years, the East has boasted 3 victors to the West's one.
about 1 month ago
Maybe you ought to take a look at last seasons standings (subsanitially larger sample). The warriors didn't make the playoffs, bu if you took their record in to the east ehy would have been 4th. They also beat the celtics twice and split their series with the magic and pistons.
10 teams in the west had winning records against the east last season and 7 the year before. Don't even attempt that argument.
from about 1 month ago
i already did, and won, thanks.
oh by the way...what league won the championship last year?
from about 1 month ago
nathan take a look at standings this year - east is better now
about 1 month ago
1. I hope you're right
2. I'll tell you why you're wrong
3. 'Sheed never has been and never will be, in any argument, the best player in the league
4. I'm a Piston fan, see my article today [Why Allen Iverson Is "The (Short Term) Answer" to the Pistons' Problems] and you'll see why this makes sense
Tonight's game against Boston showcased everything I don't like about A.I. Check out the stats. He was 5 of 13 from the field, lead the team in scoring with 16 points (and also lead with four assists) but he had four TO's and the team had 17 assists and 16 TO's. JD made this trade in an effort to avoid just getting back to the Eastern Conference finals - but also to clear cap room. If they get to the finals, great, if not, they can cut loose 'Sheed and A.I., two of their oldest players.
Dumars has made some great deals over the years, but he messed up big time in taking Darko 2nd overall. Everybody (most Piston fans) will remember that pick could have been 'Melo, but where would this team be now with Chris Bosh? In my opinion, the Pistons haven't had a real center since Bob Lanier. You can't call Laimbeer or James Edwards real centers, they spent too much time outside and/or with their backs to the basket. Ben Wallace, a great defender from the four spot, but that was probably Dumars' saving grace, not re-signing him. What about Nazr Mohammed - thankfully he was jettisoned too.
I'm waiting for the handshake agreement that's probably in place for McDyess, but we've got about two more weeks for that.
As far as the free agent class is concerned next year, I can't see Kobe leaving LA (but I'm pretty sure he would qualify as a "max-money" guy, he still wants to prove he can win without Shaq and he wouldn't be a good fit. Nash would be a nice addition, but if A.I. is making $21 million this year, Nash is a bargain to the Suns next year, with a team option around $13 million. From there, the options (in no particular order) are: Boozer, who is smaller than 'Sheed, but 7 years younger, Shawn Marion, Okur and Lamar Odom. Of course, A.I. and 'Sheed could come back...for a whole lot less money.
about 1 month ago
Tony wrote: "if McDyess does return to the team that traded him with Chauncey Billups for Allen Iverson, I do not see the possibility of another team stopping the charge to the championship"
I enjoyed reading the article, but I think with a statement like the one above you are being overly optimistic. The Celtics have twice now demolished the Pistons and the possible return of McDyess will do little to reverse Boston's dominance.
The loss of Billups was HUGE, because that was the one area where the Pistons had a clear advantage over the Celtics. Since Iverson cannot post-up Rondo like Chauncey used to, he will have to beat him with quickness. Unfortunately for Detroit, Rondo is just as quick and has younger legs.
We saw last night how Iverson started well on fresh legs, but virtually disappeared once the toll of running up and down the court began to mount. Rondo began driving to the basket with ease, because Iverson simply could not keep up with him. This, in turn, put pressure on Detroits 'bigs', since they had to leave their man and try to stop the quicker Rondo.
from about 1 month ago
To be honest, I do see where you are coming from. However, the reason I am being so optimistic is because the Pistons have not had a true test against the Celtics. Their first game was still at the earliest stages of the Iverson era, and they did not have possibly their strongest bench player after halftime. Their second matchup was against a rested Boston team, while they were on the tail end of a back to back, the first game of which was against a very good Cleveland team, followed by the atmostpheric pressures of a flight to Boston on the same day.
Unfortunately, the biggest issue facing the team right now is their defense. They have implemented a fantastic zone over the past couple of years, a defensive strategy that is necessary when you have an incapable man-to-man defender like Iverson. Iverson would not be as much of a liability if they played zone, but even though he has admitted he knows it works, Curry will not use it because he believes it to be cheap. Other teams are using strong zones against us, but Curry believes that playing the 'right' way, even in the face of others using this strategy, is more important than winning at all costs. Once he figures out that we need to start using zone again at all costs, our defense will improve.
about 1 month ago
Tony --
Winners and champions don't make excuses my friend. And if you want to give the Pistons a free pass for getting their asses handed to them, not just once, but twice, because of "well they just aquired A.I., and their schedule is though, and they just flew from Det. to Bost., well to me that sounds like a team not ready for a championship run.
Guess what. I can say Boston played 120 games last year in their grueling championship run, and for them to come out with an 11-2 record, and dominating the Pistons, and showing no sign of a slow start after winning the title (like most teams) is ridiculously impressive. They have an "out"/excuse, but they shouldn't pull that card. Nor should you with the excuses you make for Detroit.
Fine, they can have an off night. I didn't expect them to look like an all-star team in AI's first game against Boston. Nor did I think they should have won handedly in AI's seventh game with Detroit against Boston last night. BUT THEY DIDN'T LOSE TONY -- THEY GOT DOMINATED.
You gotta see it for what it is my friends. A team not deserving complete respect yet -- they have to earn it. They have to play every night and play hard. And CAN NOT be owned by the champs like this again.
They got two more chances to turn it around. For now, Celts own the Pistons.
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