Enigmatic Debate: Money in the Bank, Sting as Champ, Immortal and More

Hamster EnigmaAnalyst IIIJuly 17, 2011

Enigmatic Debate: Money in the Bank, Sting as Champ, Immortal and More

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    Welcome dear readers to the 5th edition of the Enigmatic Debate.

    In case you didn't know there have been four editions already in the past four weeks! (We're consistent I know)

    This marks the fifth straight week that the Enigmatic Debate has been released.

    In case you don't know what the Enigmatic Debate is, or need to refresh your memory because you forgot, I'll be happy to remind you.

    It's basically a debate revolving around the hot topics in today's wrestling world.

    The Enigmatic Debate is a debate involving the writers from the Enigmatic Generation of Wrestling site, also known as EGW, and constant contributors to Bleacher Report as well.

    We discuss a variety of things WWE and TNA, or Impact Wrestling (whatever it wants to call itself), related.

    This week's topics include.......naw, I won't spoil it for you, keep reading to find out. But I will give you a hint, none of the questions are about Sin Cara's lighting and if they are going to be in the Smackdown Money in the Bank ladder match. (Sorry to disappoint those of you who want to know the answer to this very interesting question.)

    On a side note though, RiZE was unable to publish it due to some "technical" difficulties so he passed the honor of publishing the Enigmatic Debate onto me. 

    Hopefully you all still like it as much as before. (Who am I kidding, of course you will, it's a debate for goodness sakes!). 

    So click on that "Start Slideshow" button and get started already because this week provides new answers for new topics!

    And don't forget to please visit, http://theenigmaticgenerationofwrestling.wordpress.com/, for the latest news/articles from the featured writers. 

Money in the Bank Predictions

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    Ryan Frye:  

    Money In The Bank Predictions

    WWE Championship: John Cena © vs. CM Punk

    This one is very difficult to predict, as we have many unknown factors here.
    The first scenario is that John Cena squashes Punk, Punk leaves with his tail tucked firmly between his legs and kids go home happy.

    The second scenario is Punk winning, only for Raw’s Money In The Bank winner to cash in, and save John Cena’s job (as Punk doesn’t leave with the WWE Championship.) This could be his way out, or spark a feud for the title.

    Lastly, CM Punk could win, and we could go off the air not knowing what’s going to happen.

    Personally, I would be fine with the second or third options, as long as it’s not the first. The most likely would probably be the second, but on the otherhand, it’s the most predictable.

    World Heavyweight Championship: Randy Orton © vs. Christian

    This match seems to be overlooked due to all the hype surrounding other matches. With that being said, this is also an interesting storyline and I have no doubt we’ll witness another spectacular match.
    I believe the only way to extend this feud is by giving Christian the title. You simply cannot have Christian beg for his fifth rematch.

    So, I see Christian winning so this feud can last at least until SummerSlam.

    Raw Money In The Bank Match

    Both Evan Bourne and Jack Swagger have absolutely no chance at winning this match. I mean, combined, they hardly get a good five minutes on television on Monday nights, if any.

    I don’t see R-Truth winning. He is 39 years old and his character is quickly becoming more comic relief than main event caliber Superstar. To make matters worse, his moveset is extremely bland.

    Alex Riley and The Miz have a feud to continue, so I am not predicting either will win. Riley needs more time, and Miz doesn’t need to win another briefcase anyway.

    Rey Mysterio has been getting jobbed out, and has had little air time. Therefor, he isn’t winning this match.

    This boils us down to two: Kofi Kingston and Alberto Del Rio.

    I would love to see Kofi win, but Alberto Del Rio is such a favorite here, I must pick him.

    SmackDown Money In The Bank Match 

    Rather than disecting each man for this match, I will go ahead and eliminate five; Heath Slater, Sin Cara, Kane, Justin Gabriel and Daniel Bryan.

    That leaves Wade Barrett, Cody Rhodes and Sheamus.

    Wade Barret’s air time has cut down substantially since moving to SmackDown. He is floating around in mid-card hell, so I just don’t see him winning. Of course, the same could have been said for Jack Swagger before he won his Money In The Bank match.

    Cody Rhodes can use a little more seasoning before hitting the main event, although I’d love to see him take on former Legacy buddy Randy Orton, with Ted DiBiase in his corner.

    Sheamus will win this match, it is fairly obvious to me.

    Mark Henry vs. Big Show

    Whoever wins, this should be a five-star ma…. Okay, I was kidding, hopefully they get this one out of the way quickly.

    I see Mark Henry winning, as they would want to build on his recent heel turn, and make out to be a monster heel.

    Divas Championship: Kelly Kelly © vs. Brie Bella

    Who knows, and who cares, the WWE will probably flip a coin to determine the winner of this match.

    I guess Kelly Kelly, and maybe we can see Beth Phoenix turn heel and spark a new rivalry.

    Hamster Fan:

    Let me start off with the predictable prediction. Brie vs Kelly with Kelly retaining her championship.

    Then comes the unpredictable part, Mark Henry vs Big Show. Both men have been made to look dominant but since Henry has been getting most of the upperhand during this feud, I’ll go with him as the winner for the match.

    As for Money in the Bank, on the Smackdown side I’m hoping for a Barrett win, the man deserves it so much to gain a lot of his credibility back. But the realistic choice is most likely Sheamus as the winner.

    On the Raw side, I’m hoping for an A-Ri win (wishful thinking I know) but it could help him get pushed a bit farther up the ladder. Plus, he’s already got the briefcase, maybe he somehow makes it go his way? But honestly, the realistic choice is Alberto Del Rio cause it’s his destiny and all that stuff.

    For Christian/Orton, I believe that it’ll be Christian’s moment once again. He HAS to win to add depth to the feud and keep his credibility. But the problem I see happening is that he may be screwed by the Smackdown MitB winner and lose his belt even quicker than last time. I pray it doesn’t happen but it’s a possibility.

    And for the main attraction of the PPV in Punk/Cena, I’ve got to go with Punk. Punk wins, Cena gets fired, and the title doesn’t leave the WWE because the MitB winner (Alberto del Rio) cashes it in and loses but uses his number one contender shot and then wins.

    Charlie Groenewegen:

    Money in the Bank is this Sunday and I’d be lying if I said I was excited. Even this old TNA mark is looking forward to it. It’s Money in the F’n Bank!

    This is year I think everybody is looking forward to a different match rather than the 8-man ladder match.

    John Cena vs. CM Punk has been going great and everybody wants to know what’ll happen next.

    Brie Bella vs. Kelly Kelly:
    Kelly Kelly is going to win. She’s Vince McMahon’s personal favorite. It’s going to be a typical Divas match. Bathroom!

    Big Show vs. Mark Henry:
    I’d like to say Mark Henry because I love the fact that he is going around and destroying anything he wants. WWE finally created a monster heel again. But now the monster heel is fighting a monster face?

    As much as Henry should win and move up on the card, I doubt WWE will give him this one.

    Smackdown Money in the Bank:
    Hmm…I see either Sheamus, Wade Barrett or Cody Rhodes leaving Chicago with the briefcase.

    It’s too early for Slater, Gabriel and Sin Cara. Daniel Bryan would be cool but most people believe that he’ll never win a world title in WWE. Kane winning would be boring since he won last year. Not to mention, a potential World title reign as a face.

    The case feels like a waste on Sheamus. He’s already a two time WWE Champion and pretty established main eventer. It’ll be stupid to see him win.

    I want to see Wade Barrett win but in the end I predict Cody Rhodes will win.

    RAW Money in the Bank:
    RAW’s MITB match doesn’t look as good as Smackdown’s match on paper and seems pretty predictable.

    It’s either Kofi Kingston or Alberto Del Rio going to win.

    I’m going to say, Del Rio wins because it’s his destiny. Boring.

    Randy Orton vs. Christian
    I haven’t watched Smackdown in a while but after reading the results, this feud seems burnt out. Boring.

    Heel Christian isn’t working.

    Randy retains.

    John Cena vs. CM Punk:
    The toughest match of the night.

    I do believe Punk is leaving after Sunday so I think Cena will retain. I wouldn’t be surprised if Vinnie Mac shows up during this one.

    John Cavanagh:

    MITB Predictions

    1. Kelly Kelly vs. Brie Bella
    Divas Championship Match

    It was good to see Kelly get the belt and there is no reason why she should lose here. WWE is high on her and won’t think twice about taking it off her.

    Winner: Kelly Kelly

    2. Big Show vs. Mark Henery
    This feud hasn’t been bad, but that’s because they haven’t faced each other yet. It won’t be good, but Henry will win this one. Henry has been on a tear in the WWE, and will keep his momentum after MITB. He will be taken more seriously as a heel, and rise up the ranks on Smackdown. As for Big Show, he is always over no matter what, and doesn’t need a win at all. If they even want to consider continuing this feud, then Henry should win as well. For all the right reasons, Henry will win.

    Winner: Mark Henry

    3. Smackdown MITB Match

    This one is tough, yet predictable. In the coming weeks, Sheamus has been billed as the heavy favorite, but that doesn’t mean he is a lock. It has some other participants that could win, but lets look at who is not winning today. Justin Gabriel, Heath Slater, Kane, Sin Cara, and Daniel Bryan. That leaves us with Cody Rhodes, Wade Barrett, and Sheamus. These three are the front runners, but out of these three, I will choose Wade Barrett. I was definetley picking Sheamus, but Barrett needs to be known as a top heel for Smackdown, NOT Superstars. Smackdown could use another heel at the top, and Barrett has more than proved he can be in the main-event with the Nexus/John Cena angle on RAW. He is the complete package, and once Punk leaves, Barrett could be the top heel in the WWE. Sheamus will get his chance, but Barrett really needs the briefcase to be relevant again.

    Winner: Wade Barrett

    4. RAW MITB Match

    This one will be quick and easy. It is very predictable, and I’m not expecting a shocker here. Here are the participants. Kofi Kingston, Alex Riley, Rey Mysterio, Evan Bourne, the Miz, Jack Swagger, R-Truth, and Alberto Del Rio. There are only two people I see winning this thing. This one is a slight possibility, but even after being a harsh critic of his, I have to go with Kofi Kingston. I don’t know if this matters, but Rize told me Kofi and Punk were best friends. Interesting, considering that Punk is in the WWE Championship match. Will he put over Kofi? Also, he could start a feud with Punk. Punk could beat Cena, but then Kofi cashes in on Punk and wins. The next night, Punk wants a contract because he wants his rematch clause, and gets it. Very unlikely, I know. The other one, and ultimatley my first choice, is Alberto Del Rio. If Punk OR Cena win the WWE Championship, cashing in on both would make sense. If he cashes in on Cena after winning the WWE Championship, then that would set a match between them in the future (Summerslam) for Cena’s rematch clause. If Del Rio cashes in on Punk, then Cena keeps his job, Punk won the belt before his exit, and Cena will most likely face him in the future. Alberto Del Rio is my top choice for tonight.

    Winner: Alberto Del Rio

    5. Randy Orton vs. Christian
    WHC Title Match

    We have seen this match so many times, yet I am still interested to see them face off again at MITB. Why? Because I believe Christian pulls it off tonight. Orton has held the belt for a long time, and has defended it against Christian on numerous occasions. Not only does Christian deserve it, but I think Smackdown needs a title change. Orton has not been a good leader for Smackdown. With Christian getting the belt back after losing the title in less than a week in his last title possession, it will be interesting if he wins it again. If Orton wins by a screwy finish, then Christian automatically wins the belt. Look for Christian to score a dirty win and cause a whole new controversy.

    Winner: Christian

    6. CM Punk vs. John Cena
    WWE Championship Title Match

    This match is the most anticipated match of the night. This match is a big reason people will be ordering MITB tonight. It has been a long time since there has been this much hype and excitement over the WWE Championship, or any WWE angle. Punk is leaving, but is leaving on top which is suprising. Punk could win, but only if he signs a contract or is cashed on by Del Rio (my pick for RAW MITB). Honestly, that is what I see happening. Punk will win, because WWE has tried desperatley to resign him, but to no avail (or so we think). I believe that WWE wants to show Punk they are willing to give him the WWE Championship, and that he will be treated as a top guy. I think there are two possible scenarios. He can win and Del Rio cashes in and wins, sending Punk out while Cena keeps his job. Or, Punk wins and runs away, but signs the contract on RAW the next night, also keeping Cena his job. I don’t see Cena winning at all suprisingly. Therefore, Punk wins.

    Winner: CM Punk (possible cash-in by Del Rio)

Which Snub Most Deserves to Be a MITB Ladder Match?

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    Hamster Fan:

    The snub most deserving of a shot in the Money in the Bank ladder match is Dolph Ziggler.

    He’s the United States Champion and can adapt well in the ring and possibly perform well with ladders.

    Plus, he was once champion so it wouldn’t seem completely crazy if he won MitB.

    Charlie Groenewegen:

    I would have Drew McIntyre and Zack Ryder in the RAW Money in the Bank. I’d replace them for Del Rio and Truth.

    McIntyre is trying to prove himself to be the future of the WWE. That’s hard to do if you haven’t had a match on RAW or PPV in a few weeks, maybe months. McIntyre deserves the chance.

    Zack Ryder is one of the most popular WWE Superstars all thanks to YouTube. I like Ryder. I think he should also be in this match to try to prove himself and just make the fans happy.

    I’d add Ted DiBiase and Tyson Kidd to the Smackdown MITB. I’d take out Sheamus and Kane and call it a match.

    Sheamus and Kane already proved to be main eventers and I wonder why the hell they are in this.

    DiBiase is another young superstar trying to prove himself to be a future star for years to come. That’s hard to do when he’s carrying Cody Rhodes bags. DiBiase needs to ditch Cody and do his own thing.

    Why Tyson Kidd? I like him. Good in the ring and pretty misused.

    Ryan Frye:

    Which snub most deserves to be in a MITB ladder match?

    Dolph Ziggler doesn’t appear to be doing anything Sunday night, so he should have been in the match.

    They could have just crowned Del Rio the number one contender for SummerSlam (since he already won the match) and give his spot to Ziggler. 

    John Cavanagh:

    Which snub most deserves to be in a MITB ladder match?

    People will get tired of hearing this, but Zack Ryder would’ve been a great addition, and a nice suprise.

    Ryder has been successful on the internet for 22 weeks, and has only ONE match to show for it on RAW.

    John Cena said that and I agree with him 100%.

    Then, Ryder gets left out of the MITB match for RAW.

    Are you serious bro?

    Honestly, I didn’t expect Ryder to make it, because the WWE just wouldn’t. But if we are going for most deserving, then look no further then the Long Island Iced Z!

    To have one of the biggest followings in the WWE and not even be one of the eight included in the RAW MITB match is terrible on WWE’s part.

Was Putting the Title Back on Sting the Smart Thing to Do?

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    Charlie Groenewegen:

    This past IMPACT, on the Mid-Summer Nightmare, Sting defeated Mr. Anderson for the World title.

    I do NOT approve of this! Mr. Anderson has now shown me that he is, hands down, the worst TNA Heavyweight Champion of all time. That’s another article for another time.

    I was really looking forward to Kurt Angle and Ken Anderson headlining Hardcore Justice.

    Now it’s Sting and Angle? All because Angle never beat Sting?
    Angle better beat Sting because I don’t want to see the Icon walk into BFG as World Champion.

    I don’t like the title change here but if Angle wins the belt, I’ll be happy.

    Ryan Frye:

    Was putting the title back on Sting the smart thing to do?

    The TNA World Championship has changed hands far too much for my liking as of late, so no.

    I really don’t understand what the point of Anderson winning the title in the first place was.

    Sting could have lost his mind anyway, and Anderson could have joined Immortal to gain the upperhand. 

    Hamster Fan:

    No it was a STUPID thing to do.

    How old is Sting? How much times has he been champion?

    How about Daniels? How many times has he been champion?

    I would’ve prefered Daniels to finally win the belt and feud with Styles.

    Yeah, now that I think about that’d be great but let’s face reality here.

    Sting/Hogan’s happening and with Hogan’s ego, the belt was obviously needed so it was a “smart” business move for them to actually achieve their goal of pleasing Hogan and Sting.

Thoughts on the Matchup of Sting Against Kurt Angle

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    Hamster Fan:

    Sting vs Kurt Angle.

    It’s got potential to be good, maybe even great, AS LONG as there’s NO INTERFERENCE by anyone and as long as it’s given about 20 minutes. If not, then the match will basically be a preview more than an actual match to me.

    Ryan Frye:

    Thoughts on the matchup of Sting against Kurt Angle?

    Who’s the heel?

    This is a problem I see in TNA a lot.

    Can’t we just know who the good guy is and who the bad guy is?

    Seriously, it seems like many in TNA turn every other week (Scott Steiner, Mr. Anderson, The Pope?)

    I’d be more intrigued at Kurt Angle against Mr. Anderson, and it would have made much more sense.

    Charlie Groenewegen:

    Kurt Angle admitted that he never beat Sting. Now he has another chance next month at Hardcore Justice.

    I would’ve much rather seen Angle vs. Anderson but now Sting is World Champion again.

    I do like the idea of Angle vs. Sting but I think Angle vs. Anderson would be better.

Is Mr. Anderson in Immortal a Smart Move?

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    Hamster Fan:

    Again, another STUPID move.

    What is Anderson going to add to Immortal aside form the TNA championship?


    News flash, that’s been long gone by now!

    The only thing that I believe Immortal gets out of Anderson are bragging rights of having the company’s a**hole.

    Besides that, Immortal is basically holding back Mr. Anderson more than anything. He can obviously make an impact on his own, why join Immortal then?

    Charlie Groenewegen:

    I personally hate Anderson in Immortal and Anderson in general after watching this past IMPACT.

    Mr. Anderson will be remembered as the worst TNA Heavyweight Champion in my book. He has not even had one successful title defense and Eric Bischoff helped him win the belt to start his second but equally sh*tty reign.

    Anderson sucks. Immortal is fine the way it is.

    Ryan Frye:

    Is Mr. Anderson in Immortal a smart move?

    Sure, Immortal needed a main eventer to look legitimate because since Jeff Hardy left, they have been quite the mess.

    Anderson provides them a main event star, and makes Immortal more relevant.

    As far as the choice, I would prefer an Angle heel turn and Anderson to be a lone-wolf type.

Best Member of Immortal Not Named Mr. Anderson?

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    Ryan Frye:

    Best member of Immortal not named Mr. Anderson?

    Not much to choose from here, to be honest.

    Bully Ray is annoying and obnoxius. He screams his lungs out on the mic, and it makes me want to change the chanel everytime.

    Scott Steiner is awful in every way possible. You can’t understand him on the microphone, he is old and boring in the ring.

    Honestly, why did TNA bother to bring him back, he is not needed.

    Gunner is nothing special, as I talked about previously. He just doesn’t give me a main event, must watch vibe.

    I suppose that leaves me with Matt Hardy. The guy is okay on the mic, and he can put on great matches. Despite being a lunatic, Matt Hardy is pretty solid when it comes to doing his job.

    Charlie Groenewegen:

    Bully Ray.

    Bully Ray is the best member of Immortal. He has the mic skills, the in-ring skills, the experience, the look and the gimmick.

    Bully Ray is a veteran and should be the golden boy of Immortal, not Mr. Anderson. Bully Ray should be the one chasing the World title.

    Hamster Fan:

    Jeff Jarrett.

    He’s basically the one with the most championships as well as the one with the most credibility as a heel not named Anderson.

    Bully Ray’s close but the rest just don’t do it for me, not even Gunner.

    Jeff Jarrett wins this privilege for me.

Is It Time to Break Up Fortune?

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    Charlie Groenewegen:

    Is it time to break up Fortune?

    I’m wearing a Fortune t-shirt while I write this but yes and no.
    No because Fortune would be a good tool in destroying Immortal as seen on IMPACT.

    Yes because Fortune has went their separate ways ever since Lockdown. Everybody was/is doing their own thing.

    AJ fought with Bully Ray. Bobby Roode fought Ric Flair. Kazarian fought Abyss and Kendrick. Storm fought any challengers for the Tag Team titles.

    They haven’t looked like a complete unit since Lockdown. I don’t really see Fortune teaming up so much because 3 out of 5 of their members are involved in the BFG Series.

    Fortune can stay around if they keep scratching away at Immortal. Besides that, goodbye. I love all the Fortune guys, but it’s been too long.

    Ryan Frye:

    Is it time to break up Fortune?

    Nothing against Fortune, in fact, I like Fortune. But it’s to the point where these guys get held back by being in the group.

    I am done with stables, we’ve had our fill for the next ten years.

    Hamster Fan:


    Fortune shouldn’t break up.

    I kinda like them as a unit.

    I may be the only one who thinks this way but a fortune is basically the crown jewel of someone or something and to me, all the men in Forune are the crown jewels in TNA. They represent potential and define all-around superstar very well.

    Even if I wanted Fortune to break up, I doubt that it’ll happen seeing as they were the Clown posse in the latest Impact episode.

The End of the Debate...Or Is It?

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