Michigan fans, here's a bulletin:
Most WVU fans are already over "it" and have been for some time.
"It", of course, being Rich Rodriguez's departure from West Virginia. Despite protestations to the contrary by many UM fans, few here in West Virginia are obsessing.
Granted, people here don't like Rodriguez very much. When one says, "I plan on coaching at West Virginia for as long as they'll have me", it is supposed to mean that, and if one later backpedals, people tend to feel betrayed.
In Ann Arbor, some see Rod's reversal as "just business". Many knowledgeable UM fans have told me this. But, no matter. Mere dislike of a person doesn't rise to the level of obsession, as much as Michigan fans would like it to be so.
And WVU fans aren't just going to forget about a $4 million contract that he signed and now claims holds him "hostage". Not on your life. That's money for our football program, which is an investment in something we love and are passionate about.
WVU fans fully expect him to honor his contract, because he signed it. There's nothing personal or hateful about it; it's "just business".
Some UM fans seem to miss the concept that Rodriguez himself isn't doing much to move on, either. He's made the whole departure it into a drawn-out, very public dispute, instead of just honoring the terms of the contract that he himself signed. Even considering that, however expecting a contract to be honored is not an "obsession," no matter what UM fans think.
If you disagree, you can get a second opinion. Call your bank and tell them that they are "obsessing" about your mortgage payments or your car loan and that they just need to let it go. Feed them the line about the psycho ex-girlfriend, too. Then, please come back here and let us know how that worked out for you.
In all honesty, when you talk to WVU fans without becoming arrogant, resorting to insults, or trying to stereotype them, you'll find that WVU fans are polite, love their team, and the name Rodriguez is rarely mentioned.
Instead, when WVU fans talk football, they talk about the recruiting class that Stew and his crew were able to put together for 2008 in such a short time and under dire circumstances.
They're thrilled to tell of the high caliber of talent that Stew has assembled on his staff here, and they're positively giddy with the new philosophy: an already explosive offense will be completely unleashed next year. They're also incredibly excited aboutt the talent that is coming to WVU in 2009.
Michigan fans who thrive on our misfortune might be disappointed to overhear these conversations, which actually do NOT consist of bouts of hand-wringing, gnashing of teeth, self flailing, sack cloth, ashes, or wailing about how sad we are at our former coach, nor any lamentations about wanting him back.
On the rare occasion that we do talk about him, he's often the butt of a joke. For example, there's the one about Rich's house being egged after he announced he was going to Michigan. The cops were there for an hour trying to figure out who might have done it, and Rich was up the rest of the night trying to figure out how the perpetrators got the eggs from the car to the house. Rim shot, please.
But, again, making jokes about someone isn't obsessing, despite what the Ann Arbor crowd may say.
Speaking of the Ann Arbor crowd, just today, I read yet another article from one of them informing me that I should get over it.
Wow. I thought I was over it, and I thought most of my fellow fans were over it too. A contingent of UM fans seem to be the ones talking about it now. The article unnecessarily stirred up a lot of people on BOTH sides who actually might have been over it, but now are not. Good work, Mr. Womeldorf! You've done the exact opposite of what you supposedly set out to do. Or, maybe that's exactly what you wanted to do?
Here's a fundamental concept that everyone needs to remember: fights break out on every type of forum on the Web every day. The Internet is not real life, and people you don't know will readily argue with you, even if they wouldn't in real life. Ignoring those you disagree with is the best way of dealing with them, rather than calling them out by pretending to be superior. You only keep the flames going by responding, so you then lose any right to complain about someone being "obsessed" with you.
It's like poking at the hornets' nest. If you're foolish enough to do it, you don't deserve a lot of sympathy for the consequences.
But, some UM fans read these types of comments and grab their stick, then scream bloody murder about what big meanies we Mountaineers are when we respond, and how we won't leave them alone, all the while trying to take another jab at the nest.
To which I would say: Toughen up. Grow a thicker skin. You're supposed to be elite, so start acting like it. Just get over it already.
Many UM fans will be the first to brag about the eliteness of their program, but in the same breath, some will protest because little ol' WVU won't leave them alone. If one truly believes they are elite, they don't feel the need to repeat it over and over to convince themselves, and they sure shouldn't have to convince the fans of a supposedly "lesser" school like West Virginia.
And, above all, they shouldn't be affected by any criticism from us. If they're so sure of this eliteness, how come they can't just ignore all things West Virginia and move on?
Bulletin for UM fans stuck on WVU: you have a new coach, whom most of you like very much. You believe he's an innovator, that he's going to shake things up, and after a time, you'll be at the top of the Big Ten and quite possibly the country.
So, there's no further need to visit WVU message boards, no reason to respond to WVU fans, and no sense in complaining about all of it.
Yay! You win! You can now safely let the controversy die and move on.
The buyout needn't concern you as fans, since you won't be paying it nor receiving it. We don't concern you either (or so you say as you crash our message boards and insult us). If you're truly as confident in your new coach as many of you have indicated, shouldn't you be looking forward to the dawning of a new era of Wolverine football instead of messing around with us hillbillies?
Oh, if only we could be so fortunate. But alas, we still hear the tired old crying about the "jealous ex-girlfriend".
Maybe it's because Michigan football fans haven't had a lot to be smug about lately. Sure, Michigan won a bowl, but they were an also-ran in the BCS race this year from the first game of the year.
Speaking of which, we won't even begin to talk about that first game of the year. That hurts. Maybe that's why I haven't seen nearly as many UM fans talking about the bowl win as I have seen them flinging insults at Mountaineer fans.
And the fact is, since success at UM is still months or perhaps even years away, maybe some Michigan fans need to fill the time. So, they keep the controversy going, finding new and exciting stereotypes that allow them to continue to look down their noses at us.
Fine. I just hope they don't expect us to be in awe of them. Quite frankly, we're not interested.
But, months later, many UM fans still show up in various places on the Internet to poke at the hornets' nest, saying that Rich was the sole reason for success and now that he's gone, we'll return to being a mediocre program, and our new coach is an emotional hire, Oklahoma didn't show up for the Fiesta Bowl, ad nauseum.
To which I would ask, "Why are you even talking to us? Why do you care at all about WVU? Don't you have your own football program to concern yourself with?"
Apparently, if they do, it isn't much worth talking about.
Have these obsessed Wolverine fans not heard the term "whistling past the graveyard"? Look it up sometime.
Or, you might just ignore it because repeating the phrase "Jealous Ex Girlfriend" is much easier, like most poorly thought out knee-jerk reactions usually are.
Hopefully, at some point, these UM fans will quit crying about the big, mean West Virginians saying all those nasty things about their coach, once and for all.
It's your turn, Michigan fans. Let's see if you can get over it and move on.
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about 1 month ago
I, too, love the line that we're headed to mediocrity without Rodriguez which fits nicely with the argument that WVU has been injured by his departure and, henceforth, due the $4M buyout. Furthermore, the "jilted ex" comment that they trumpet like a schizophrenic parrot simply allows them to avoid the real facts which make their coach look, well, not so good and, we can't have that. Finally, just how do they reconcile the fact that RFRaud said in his depostion that, had WVU fired him, he would've expected to be paid the $4M buyout which is a statement thick with irony given that he made this statement in a deposition to a lawsuit filed against him for trying to weasel out of his $4M obligation.
about 1 month ago
Regarding Rodriguez:
It's not about Football when a WVU fan mentions Rodriguez. It hasn't been since December.
It's about business. It's all about a legal binding contract and one party's insistence that it isn't "fair".
Now the courts will decide.
Nothing personal. Has nothing to do with WVU football. It's just business.
from about 1 month ago
Good point, ExPatriateEer. I've edited my article to reflect this idea. See Paragraph #7.
about 1 month ago
Im not a WVU fan. Im indifferent when it comes to them. I have to side with WVU fans on this. Im tired of reading message boards on various sites and reading Skunk Bear fans say "Get over it". Its a matter of business and contractual obligations. Im not sure Mountaineer fans believe RR is the best college coach or their savior. RR seems to be the one drawing this out and in public no less. Each time he opens his mouth he looks worse, and then the Skunk Bear Nation chimes in with the same old response of jelousy.
Its old and tired, and once fall practice begins in August, nobody will care much either way.
about 1 month ago
Christopher,
This is the best article I've seen on this subject in a long time. It should be required reading for ESPN, Sporting News, and especially Freep sports reporters.
I think most of the Michigan comments stem from a collective guilty conscience. Their university got caught with its hand in the cookie jar, which just doesn't fit with their definition of the vaunted "Michigan Man." And they just can't seem to get over that.
about 1 month ago
As an ND alum, believe me when I say that UM people are usually the ones stirring the pot. Just look at all the fuss over Weis' "to hell with Michigan" comment last week. Given their situation, I would say that UM people are trying to deflect attention away from their team and the struggles that most people expect them to have, but in reality they're pretty annoying all the time.
from about 1 month ago
As an OSU fan, I agree Michigan makes much out of nothing. But it was a dumb comment for any coach to make about a rival. You just don't say that when any kind of tape is rolling, whether it be audio or video.
about 1 month ago
Great to hear you're "over it." RR is too, no doubt. But to suggest that a contract that was fraudulently induced should just be honored is ridiculous. Ed Pastilong lied under oath, as will the WVU President. Why did they lie? They lied so that meddling Gov. Manchin could give cover to his crony.
If you expect Michigan or its coach to pay for a lie - you don't understand business.
I hope you all do well next year and in the future. I know Michigan will - we always do.
As to the ND poster: I'd keep my yap shut until you pass 0.5.
from about 1 month ago
Bob,
He signed a contract. When presented with the same buyout at Michigan, he signed again. Business is business. He just needs to pay what he owes.
And then Michigan can move on.
from about 1 month ago
Comment for Bob re: "a contract that was fraudulently induced "
The contract was presented to RRR months before he signed it. RR and his representatives made annotations (that means "Changes and additions" Bob) to the contract which were then included in the finished document that RR signed.
So where is the fraud?
about 1 month ago
So over it that you're writing an article as such..right.
As for the "to hell with Michigan", the general consesus seems to be "Uh, did a guy with a 3-9 record last year who we beat 38-0 just say we're going to make excuses?" No one is upset, just befuddled that he of all people is taking a shot at us.
And the whole deposition, it depends on your view point of the situation. It'll either get paid or it won't, who cares about the rest?
To those who feel that WVU is somehow better off without RR, time will tell. But the guy's track record speaks for itself. He made you into a national power for a brief time all while collecting the recruiting scraps. Just because you don't like him anymore (and you have reasons, I won't deny) doesn't mean you need to pretend he never did a good thing for you.
Truly get over it. Stop talking about him and the deposition, stop talking about how much you hate him and what a scumbag you think he is, stop talking about how the program is so much better off without him. He went his separate way and all involved need to move on.
Let it be.
from about 1 month ago
Is that right? First of all, just who TF are you to regulate what I say or think? I didn't think the quote in your article about "we're Michigan, you're not" was all that arrogant but the above post sure as hell is. What if I told you that you could only blog what I tell you to blog. Unbelievable. If it were up to Michigan fans, WVU fans could not be upset. They could not say a derogatory word. They'd have to eat the $4M buyout. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. It they can't do all of those things then, they're obviously "psychotic ex-girlfriends." It's because of these attitudes that WVU fans want to see Michigan crash and burn and this condescending attitude shoved up your collective arses.
from about 1 month ago
"So over it that you're writing an article as such..right."
My article is about Michigan fans like yourself, who just this week continue to write articles to stir up trouble between our fanbases. It's not about Rodriguez. You see, we've moved on. How come you can't stop talking about it? You'd be happier if you let it go.
"To those who feel that WVU is somehow better off without RR, time will tell. "
For anyone who's not a WVU fan, or a fan of a team who plays us, I can't imagine why it matters. Unless there's some other compulsion that keeps you monitoring our football program, you really need to stop thinking about it and concentrate on Michigan football.
"Truly get over it. Stop talking about him and the deposition,..."
Where did I talk about it?
"...stop talking about how much you hate him and what a scumbag you think he is..."
Where did I say that?
"...stop talking about how the program is so much better off without him."
Why? I know you don't want to celebrate your recent coaching change, instead choosing to keep stirring up trouble with WVU fans. Maybe because you're really not happy with Rod and the controversy. I don't know, nor do I want to.
I however, will continue to talk about how our program will continue to grow under our new leader, because I'm excited about football and the future, a sentiment you obviously aren't experiencing.
See, you're the one still talking about Rodriguez and WVU and the lawsuit. I was writing about people like YOU, who still try to stir up trouble and need to get over it. Just let it go and enjoy your new coach.
about 1 month ago
Wow Bob. Way to thiink for yourself there big guy. lol. I guess Fraud couldn't possibly lie. I mean, geez, he's shown his character is beyond reproach hasn't he. lol.
You Michigan fans are the blindest I have ever seen. When it comes to Rodriguez, it's all about
"see no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil" with you Michiganers.
about 1 month ago
I think the UM fans seem to be blind to a very important point .... West Virginians and those who love Mountaineer football put integrity and honor above winning a football game. We are proud people, hard workers, and strive to make an honest living. We still believe that a handshake and your word are what makes a man.
Those values may not exist in Michigan, but they are very much a part of life in WV. No one is going to deny that Rich helped grow this program - but we are very disappointed that one of our own has gone against the values that we all strive to maintain. We find it interesting in his deposition that he thought it was very fair that he be compensated the 4 million if he were to be terminated, however it is grossly unfair if he were the one to have to pay the 4 million - yet he goes and signs another deal that has a 4 million buyout.
All that said, we are very happy to have Bill Stewart. He has every characteristic of an honorable man that knows the value of his word and a handshake and we feel confident that he will make every effort to live up to those values. All one has to do is look back over the past 30 years to see that WVU is not a program that abandons a coach for a losing season - in fact we've always had a deep respect for the coach of our program. Coach Stewart is just our 3rd coach in the last 28-29 years. The previous two coaches (Don Nehlen & Rich Rodriguez) left on their own terms - so as you can see, there is an enormous loyalty factor associated with WVU football and the fans. Rich Rodriguez has betrayed that loyalty on his own terms and needs to at least honor his contract if not his words if he wishes to save face at all with the WVU faithful. We think that is little to ask.
In closing, there is one additional point i'd like to make. Rich had a job for life as head coach of the Mountaineers - win or lose, we would have stood by him and allowed him to retire here. Maybe it's not Michigan, but he pretty much had lifetime job security. What will happen in Michigan 3-5 years from now if UM hasn't won a Big Ten title? My assumption is the fans and the university will see to it he is replaced promptly and throw him to the Wolves (no pun intended).
about 1 month ago
We didn't want RR. We wanted Miles but couldn't get him. We panicked, rushed, and got a man that while wins, I simply cannot be excited about. Lloyd Carr was what I expect from MI, and RR is no Carr. I think that RR should pay the $4m, but if he can prove that the contract was illegal, then he does not have too.
I am upset that some would insinuate that "We [WV fans] are proud people, hard workers, and strive to make an honest living. We still believe that a handshake and your word are what makes a man. Those values may not exist in Michigan, but they are very much a part of life in WV." Anyone who will brazenly insult a entire population that he has had limited personal contact with is a bigot, completely counter to what the article says regarding the high character of WV fans. Not all MI fans are good people, not all WV fans are good people. Please avoid blanket statements about either.
about 1 month ago
Wow, a bunch of over sensitive WVU fans. Ease up there, fellas.
WVUWeapon, at what point did I tell you explicitly what to do? Did I make a threat? No! I simply stated that to truly get over it, that's what has to be done. Not writing articles saying as such so you can just calm your over-hyped ass down.
To Christopher, I never said I'd be keeping track, I just made a simple statement: only time will tell. Also, I should've clarified by saying "you" meant WVU fans, not you individually.
To all of you who think that Michigan fans turn a blind eye to anything RichRod does: what the hell has he done other than leave your university before his deal expired? And, I'm sorry, but I don't see you jumping up the asses of Nick Saban, Bobby Petrino, etc. It's the way of the coaching world. If you can find greener pastures, God bless you and go take it. No one else would turn down more money. But you're acting as if he's some scumbag who scorned the entire university of West Virginia and tried to bring it down.
He just wanted out, that's all there is to it.
So you can all just calm your lunatic rants.
from about 1 month ago
"Wow, a bunch of over sensitive WVU fans. Ease up there, fellas."
This is exactly what I'm talking about. You can't stop. You must continue with the insults and jabs. You're completely helpless at this point. Sad.
Why will you not just be happy with your coach, without this expectation that WVU fans should love you?
"To Christopher, I never said I'd be keeping track, I just made a simple statement: only time will tell. Also, I should've clarified by saying "you" meant WVU fans, not you individually."
Only time will tell if the UC Santa Cruz Banana Slugs will ever field a Division I football team. But, even if it happens, it doesn't pertain to me, so I fail to see why I would find it important enough to comment about it on the Internet. Unless there's some other reason...
"what the hell has he done other than leave your university before his deal expired?"
Um...maybe it's because he failed to pay his bills?
As a football program, we're fine now. No one really cares about Rodriguez, other than the fact that he needs to pay up. And I hope he does soon, so Michigan fans can finally move on.
"But you're acting as if he's some scumbag who scorned the entire university of West Virginia and tried to bring it down."
Nope. YOU'RE acting as if we believe that, by writing articles about it and keeping the controversy alive on the internet. I never said it. He's just a guy who owes my favorite football team some money. But I'm not surprised that you'd say this. Lashing out at WVU fans is nothing a big straw man that many UM fans enjoy knocking down over and over again to make themselves feel good.
No one between Newell and Bluefield cares.
"So you can all just calm your lunatic rants."
You just showed your hand here. You're the one getting personal. You're the one who can't let go. Again, you just had to get a jab in. Poor creature.
You need to calm down and realize we don't hate your coach, and even if we did, it doesn't matter! You're Michigan, remember? Elite program, storied tradition, all that. You don't need our approval, so why are you trying so hard to change our minds?
Your coach just needs to pay what he owes so you guys can get on with your lives and quit obsessing on WVU and its fans.
from about 1 month ago
So, Mr.Pompous, are you the pot or the kettle?
from about 1 month ago
"So, Mr.Pompous, are you the pot or the kettle?"
I'd like to point out that you failed to respond to the substance of what I stated, instead choosing to offer more insults.
I doubt any true Michigan fans would be proud of your ongoing efforts at this point. You're making yourself and your school look bad. Let it go already.
from about 1 month ago
Jesus, is everything an insult to you?
And I got personal because I stated the obvious? The obvious being that most of the people who have responded resulted to insult-slinging and nasty remarks when I haven't insulted anyone, stated my opinion yet you come back at me like everything is scientific fact.
He owes the program money? Congrats to that! Who cares? You're over it? Then why write the article?
As much sense as you think you make, you make none. Let it go, stop acting like Mr.Pompous and I'd go away. You haven't proven anything to me other than "I don't care what happens this year with Michigan" and "RichRod owes us money".
from about 1 month ago
Well, lol @ me Ryan.
"WVUWeapon, at what point did I tell you explicitly what to do? Did I make a threat? No! I simply stated that to truly get over it, that's what has to be done."
You just told me to calm my over-hyped ass down. That's pretty explicit. Furthermore, from the above statement, how does a Michigan fan presume to know what "has to be done" for a WVU fan to truly get over it or even judge whether or not we have. Should I judge you because you stand behind a coach who refuses to honor his contract? Should I presume that honor is no longer the requirement of the archetype Michigan man/coach? Apparently so. If anything you're fairly pompous. You don't have the slightest inkling what it is like to be a WVU fan but yet, you have the cure for what ails us. Lol @ you.
from about 1 month ago
"...is everything an insult to you?"
Pompous certainly is. Perhaps if you had manners, you'd have known this already.
"And I got personal because I stated the obvious?"
No, you got personal because you called me pompous. When did you state the obvious? I missed that part.
"The obvious being that most of the people who have responded resulted to insult-slinging and nasty remarks when I haven't insulted anyone, stated my opinion yet you come back at me like everything is scientific fact."
Oh, is THIS the obvious? If it really is obvious, did you need to restate it? But no matter; I see why you did, because you now want to add the claim that you didn't insult people when you clearly did. You've used the words pompous, lunatic, over-hyped, over-sensitive, etc. and as a result, expect us to immediately see your point of view and accept it. That's not really how a reasoned discussion works. You have to make logical points instead of simply insulting your opposition, see? Maybe make them sound a little more like scientific fact and less like the ravings of a madman.
"He owes the program money? Congrats to that! Who cares?"
I do. Is this your attitude toward your own debts and obligations as well?
"You're over it? Then why write the article?"
Because one thing I've certainly NOT gotten over is hearing certain UM fans like yourself constantly whining about how sad it is that we don't like their coach. As I've stated, you need to move on. What WVU thinks about your coach should NOT matter this much to you.
"As much sense as you think you make, you make none."
Wow. You've just conclusively refuted everything I've said with that single sentence. Amazing. You should have said that first. Could have saved us both a lot of time. Man, you told me I didn't make sense. What am I going to say to that?
"Let it go, stop acting like Mr.Pompous and I'd go away."
Please don't. Your maniacal babbling proves my point way better than the story I wrote. You're a living, breathing example of what I said. Thank you for repeating the insult, too...it really is a nice touch.
"You haven't proven anything to me other than "I don't care what happens this year with Michigan" and "RichRod owes us money". "
And, you've proven exactly what I've said from the beginning. You can't let it go. You have to keep coming back insult and be hateful so you can feel superior, and you've already stated that you'll continue to do so, unless I change the way I post about my OWN story to conform to what YOU think it should be?
Do you have any idea how creepy you sound right now, Mr. Control Freak?
I feel sorry for you. You really CAN'T put it down, can you?
about 1 month ago
I'm a WVU grad and while I was disappointed in RR leaving the way he did, especially being he's also an alum, I'm really just interested in one main thing...coaches should be held to their contract agreements. We've seen it at many other schools lately where coaches want to get paid if they get fired, but they want to renegotiate when they leave on their own. I'm proud that WVU is standing up to enforce the content of the contract as hopefully it will curb the assumption that contracts aren't worth the paper they're written on.
I'm sure RR will have success at Michigan...how can't he with the recruits they get on a regular basis. And I had my doubts about the emotional hire of Coach Stew, but he has impressed me with the hires he's made and the already exceptional recruiting class for 2009 that is flourishing.
Both schools will be fine. I understand it's fun to bicker and nobody likes to let the last word sit there, but to WVU fans this is much more a disappointment about one of our own leaving in a less than classy way...then taking opportunities to throw salt in the wound by not standing up to his responsibilities that he penned his name to. Coaches shouldn't be freed from large contracts any more than we should for small ones.
What kind of fans would we be if we didn't care at all??? It's the principal of the thing...and once it is resolved I hope we can simply settle it on the field. I, for one, am quite confident in WVU under those circumstances. Long term...good luck to both schools and coaches.
about 1 month ago
"Anyone who will brazenly insult a entire population that he has had limited personal contact with is a bigot..."
Exactly how many times, sir, have you been called a toothless, barefoot hillbilly who may or may not fornicate with an immediate family member or have a vehicle on blocks in the front yard? Unless you have, please don't lecture us on this point, because frankly, sir, I don't think what you've heard stated about Michigan can't even begin to compare.
My point is, we've been told repeatedly by Michigan fans that Rodriguez promising to stay "for a long time" then not doing it is "just business", while Garrison promising to reduce the buyout then not is "a violation of a verbal contract." I think West Virginians believe that some Michigan fans try to have it both ways.
But, I understand what you are saying. Please note that I have tried to write my article using "most" and "many" and other such statements to keep from stereotyping the way I have been stereotyped, and I completely understand your need to come in and defend your home state, and I have no doubt that there are honest people there, and what one sees on the Internet doesn't represent the average Michigan fan.
Good luck in the upcoming season.
about 1 month ago
Has rich rods bastard child from the cheerleader been born yet? Maybe UM will recruit him/her too.
about 1 month ago
I'm a michigan fan and find this article stereotipical towards myself and fellow michigan fans. I really have no idea what you are doing down at WVU and frankly don't care. nor do I care about Rodriguez's contract buyout or his personal life. There is no hostility up here towards WVU. You are not a rival or in our conference and the only time we would play you is in a rare bowl game. I like your program and how you have worked your way up to become a national powerhouse the last few years. I do give credit to Rodriguez for much of that success but none the less you are in a position now that you can get more big time recruits and try and carry on the tradition. Just so you know I do represent the average michigan fan. I have been one my whole life and am currently attending the University of Michigan. All of your stereotypes I beleive come from the press, and "michigan fans" who aren't true to the maize and blue. Bashing is a waste of time and am disgusted at this article which I came across web surfing. I don't see this as a reflection of the typical WVU fans beliefs as basing someones personality and morals based on what college athletic program they support? Don't get caught up in the politics of sports and become hostile towards other sports fans. Your basketball and football programs have both become more successful since your coaches have left and I hope you maintain that success in the future. Best of luck WVU.
-A True Michigan Fan
from about 1 month ago
Matthew...bottom line is, if you've never seen or done any of the things going on that the article states, then it isn't about you.
I never intended it to be a blanket statement about all Michigan fans. I tried to refer to the contingent I am talking about as "some UM fans" and other terms which do NOT include the whole. I probably could do better and may go back and edit when I have time. I realize most Michigan fans are sensible people who aren't letting this get to them and don't feel the need to lash out at Mountaineer fans, but there is a small but vocal minority who is beating the dead horse, just as there would be with any issue for any segment of society.
"All of your stereotypes I beleive come from the press, and "michigan fans" who aren't true to the maize and blue. "
Most West Virginians know a thing or two about what it is like to be stereotyped, and I don't feel I'm an exception to this. It was never my intention to stereotype anyone. I can tell by your response that you are definitely NOT one of the people that I refer to in the article.
Also, please note that the article came about as a response to the very anti-West Virginia article by a poster on this thread.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/20404-Get-Over-it-WVU-290408
"Bashing is a waste of time and am disgusted at this article which I came across web surfing. "
I feel everything I said was well founded and I stand by it, keeping in mind that I was not talking about UM fans as a whole, but the portion who felt, especially after the Rodriguez fiasco, that it was funny to rub salt in the wound of upset WVU fans. Of course, that wound has healed, but those fans refuse to see that we've moved on and still try to get a rise out of us from time to time.
Thanks for commenting. It is good to hear from reasonable fans of any team. No one expects you to adopt a different point of view; most fans of all teams just want to be treated with respect. I appreciate you doing just that.
Best of luck to you and your team in 2008.
about 1 month ago
"To all of you who think that Michigan fans turn a blind eye to anything RichRod does: what the hell has he done other than leave your university before his deal expired? And, I'm sorry, but I don't see you jumping up the asses of Nick Saban, Bobby Petrino, etc. It's the way of the coaching world. If you can find greener pastures, God bless you and go take it. No one else would turn down more money. But you're acting as if he's some scumbag who scorned the entire university of West Virginia and tried to bring it down."
Yes, you are blind. Have you even listened to the man drag WVU and West Virginia through the mud? That touched off a firestorm of steroetypical vitriol from UM fans directed at WVU fans. You know what is the best indicator that Rodriguez is far from righteous throughout all of this? That he wasn't even man enough to turn in his resignation personally nor did he actually confront anybody about the problems he was having except in the form of an ultimatum which, IMO, was only meant to justify his leaving in his own convoluted mind. He's always hiding behind somebody. a graduate assistant (resignation letter), his wife, his agent, etc. Also, how the heck do you know what any of our feelings are about Bobby Petrino or Nick Saban? Presumption seems to be a staple of yours...
Bottom line, Rodriguez left because he wanted to go to Michigan. It's a prestige thing, I get that and I don't have any problem with that. Most WVU fans feel the same. However, what we also feel is that the man should've been mature enough and man enough to be upfront about it as well as honor his contract.
about 1 month ago
So here's the deal: I am an ardent Mountaineer fan and supporter; I go to all the home games, some away games and go to the bowls; graduated from WVU way back in the day when couch burning was invented in Sunnyside; was raised on the Mounties; check for news articles on the web as part of my morning ritual; go to fundraising events; donate; know the fight song; and bleed Old Gold and Blue. I am a typical hardcore Mountaineer fan and alum. The one thing I have not participated in much is responding to blogs and blogging in general. I usually read the blogs and take them with a grain of salt. They usually contain a decent amount of "heart over head" commentary wherein someone is an idiot and the other person a genius. Unkind words are often uttered. Uninformed voices often are raised collectively in a unanimous clamor of "we are better than you because. . ." or "you suck because. . ." Basically, "my dad can beat up your dad" kind of stuff. Especially if you want to get into discussion about why the SEC is the best conference in the universe and all other conferences pale in comparison.
So who cares, right? Aren't we all just a bunch of college football crazed people killing time procrastinating from doing our work and reading and writing about our love of our team? Are all WV fans unreasable hillbillies who can't think sanely about this topic? Are all Michigan fans elitist snobs who stare down their noses at all other lesser programs? No. Do both exist? Sure. People are people right? They come in all shapes and sizes, so why bother getting all worked up? All this blogger stuff is just silly right? Just people venting and chest thumping. . .
But (there is always a but). . .the burning question still burns (or not). . .are we over "it"? If someone is still reading about "it" and still writing about "it", perhaps we are not yet over "it". For my part, I am sort of over "it" and sort of not over "it". I remember when I was over "OJ" and turned off all the noise about the trial of the century. I remember when I was over the Democrat's debates. I know when I'm over a certain band because they have become so oversaturated in the radio music rotation that I can't bear to hear them anymore. I had a roommate once who listened to so much Pink Floyd I can now no longer tolerate salmon and take an immediate disliking to anyone named "Floyd". Heck, I can barely watch Andy Griffith because of Floyd the Barber. . .but I digress.
Are we over it down here in good old West By God Virginia? I have friends who think RR is the Mountaineer equivalent of The Godfather's Fredo who took sides against the family and who is now dead to them. And I have friends who think having any animosity toward a coach who leaves your program for another program is just plain silly because people change jobs all the time for money or personnel reasons or because they hate their boss. Such is life.
For what it is worth, I have somewhat of a Jekyll and Hyde opinion on the matter. Part of me is thankful for all the fun I have had over the last few years being a Mountaineer FB fan and I give RR most of the credit for it (and likewise with basketball, Coach B--however you spell it with all those confusing i's and e's) deserves my gratitude for entertaining me for 5 years with a brand of basketball I came to absolutely love. It seemed like ages since I saw Mountaineer basketball with precise passing and creative team play, instead of the run and chuck it aproach the game had descended into when Coach Catlett left with nobody ever making a free throw. So am I appreciative of the job these two men did for our BB and FB programs? Absolutely. I give them all the credit in the world for elevating our programs to a higher level. As I have told many fellow Mountaineer fans/friends over the last few years, I think those two coaches took our programs from a level where we would beat most of the teams we were supposed to beat and would pull the ocassional upset over a better team, but would likely lose to the Miami's, VT's Georgetown's and UConn's of the world, to a much higher level where I expected us to beat all the teams we were supposed to beat and expected us to win the big games that we used to lose most of the time. When we lost, it became a surprise, not an foregone expectation of impending disappointment. Our chests swelled and we tasted sweet victory under these two coaches and came to expect blowouts, not just wins under RR. Isn't this our collective nirvana? Isn't it what every fan wants? So thank you coaches and God bless and good luck and I hope you and your families are happy and having nothing but good fortune.
That being said, part of me is absolutely furious that RR gave us his word he would never leave so long as we would have him and then he left. Part of me is disgusted that he would sign a $4M buyout in his contract and then try to get out of it--doesn't this man's word mean anything? His agent was shopping him and had been using other coaching jobs as leverage to get more money and things for the program. How dare he? He allegedly forced Calvin McGee to play the race card and besmirched a good man's reputation, offering him a job so long as he played ball. WOW! Hanging is too good for him. Hope Michigan gets 500 violations and gets the SMU death sentence when they figure out what a no good villian they have hired. Michigan is sure to go 0-12 next year and that's what they get for pilfering our best and brightest (actually he sucked and was never that great of a coach anyway). Do I really believe all of this? Of course not. Am I guilty of bitterness and sour grapes in this line of thinking? Could be. I am only human after all.
Have I had moments of despair, fear and loathing because I was afraid my beloved Mountaineers would not recover from these two departures? Sure. Huggie Bear helped alot. Fiesta Bowl helped alot. New crew of assistant coaches and recruits helps alot. Will we be just fine and continue to excell? Yep. Do we have the rich tradition of Michigan? No way. We have been around 100+ years playing football and basketball and have had our moments of greatness, but our sports programs cannot even be compared in the same breath as Michigan or Ohio State or Notre Dame or Alabama--from a tradition standpoint. That is old money. We are new money. Not new to us, but new to the country. Are we Boise State new? No but somewhere in between. Do we have unbelievable pride in our Mountaineers and are we diehard? Oh Yeah. Are they any less rabid in Ann Arbor? No. Is Columbus, Ohio a sewing circle on Saturdays in the Fall or is it a complete madhouse? Been there, done that. They get it done on a professional level on Saturdays in every serious big time program in every major sports conference town in the Fall in this beloved country of ours. Morgantown is great, but Knoxville aint too shabby either. I hear they cut loose down in Gainsville once in a great while too.
It's all about proper perspective and relativity isn't it? Everyone on these blog spots wants to say these fans are awful and arrogant and rude and those fans are wild and crazy and dangerously intoxicated and classless and we are better and my dad can beat up your dad. I rule, you suck. Seems to me we are all the same, just wearing different colors. Who is better the Crips or the Bloods? Seems to me both were just doing whatever it is that they do and just wearing different flags. West Coast East Coast, Biggie or Tupac? It's all the same. What you see and think depends upon from where you see it. Quantum Mechanics teaches us that any experiment is influenced by the mere fact that the experiment is being observed. The observer influences what happens by merely being there to observe. It is all relative.
So, football is a business and we want our money. $4M bucks is a lot of money and RR wants to keep it. We love our Mountaineers and want to win national championships. We were very afraid our golden geese could not be replaced. They were and we will be just fine. Michigan fans don't want their new coach lambasted for his old job. Michigan wants national championships and wants the days of old to return to Ann Arbor and wants to beat that team from Columbus that shall not be mentioned by name in Ann Arbor. I hope they get what they want. Go Blue!
If nothing else, RR and Coach B taught some of us that it is possible to compete at the highest levels in a rural state without the deep pockets of other states. Nehlen and Catlett never thought it could be done. They thought we were second rate and recruiting was just too hard in poor old WV. Nehlen has said as much many times. That was always his excuse, "you just can't recruit in WV, too rural, not enough players from such a timy state." I could never figure out how Nebraska did so well, being similarly situated and all. Might have been good ole Coach Osborne getting the job done. Coaches matter. Their force of will can change programs. RR has such a force of personality and will in all likelihood succeed in Michigan. If they can get used to his country ways in the old dyed in the wool place that is University of Michigan athletics. For my part I have taken a long drink of the Mountaineer Kool-Aid over the last few years and am now a true believer that we can be a perrenial top 10 or 15 program (always was a believer in that fact, actually), so yeah RR and Coach B can go in peace and all should and hopefully will be forgiven. If we don't get our cash, then there will be a valid legal reason for not getting it and if we do get it all or most of it, then it is because there is a valid legal reason we should.
Like most things in life and with people, any fault or blame for the recent unpleasantness (or as I like to call it "The War of Northern Aggression"--Michigan is north of West Virginia you see) probably lies somewhere in the middle as to why things ended so badly in December. I'm sure RR and his posse are not without fault. I'm equally sure Manchin, Garrison, Pastilong, et al are not without fault. As someone once wrote, breaking up is hard to do. At least I don't bump into RR all over town wearing his new hat and sweater as a constant reminder he has a new love interest. Aw crap I see him on TV all the time. Who am I kidding? I hate that jackass! Just wait and see. My new coach can beat up your new coach. Damn you to Hell Michigan!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Damn you to Hell!!!!!!!!!!!!
from about 1 month ago
I know I'm more than two weeks overdue in responding to this, but I just stumbled across this page and decided to read the article-disguised-as-a-comment immediately above.
This comment was a fair, level-headed, reasonable discussion of the whole situation from a true WVU fan's point of view. That is something I had yet to read (anywhere, ever) about this whole issue. If this were posted on Bleacher Report as an article, it would be easily the best perspective yet on the whole Rodriguez departure topic.
It's good to know that there exist individuals from any fanbase who can stop, step back, and see the big picture. Thank you, Jay, for renewing my faith in Mountaineer fans.
about 1 month ago
For all you Michigan fans... Look here, you keep complaining about what THE WVU FANS are saying about RR on message boards. You keep telling us to move on. The issue you fail to see - probably because your gentle sensitivities have been so bruised - is that it is Rodriguez who keeps bringing this up in the national press! WVU fans mouth off like Michigan fans do. Michigan administrators and boosters, along with WVU administrators and boosters have remained totally civil and relatively quiet.
RODRIGUEZ IS THE ONLY ONE SHOOTING HIS MOUTH OFF THAT THE SPORTING REPORTERS ARE LISTENING TO !!!
Rich Rod is the one who needs to shut up, and let the wheels of justice roll forward. The problem you Michigan folks have inherited is just this... RR is all about himself, and no one else. RR is the boy who cried wolf. It would be refreshing to see him get back to the chore of coaching and quit trying to gain the sympathy of a nation by slandering the school which truly did, give him the very foundations of everything he has and is today.
about 1 month ago
If you are all over it, how come this article needs to be written, how come all these people are giving long comments to explain that they are over it. You bring up the phsyco ex-girlfriend then say that WVU fans don't get mad until you bring up Rodriquez, phsyco ex-girlfriends can seem nice and normal until you bring up the person they are phsyco about, then they go crazy. This shows that they are in fact not over it and that they are just hiding their pain, which seems to be what WVU really are, hiding the fact that they are not in fact over it.
from about 1 month ago
THANK YOU!
from about 1 month ago
So it is OK for michigan fans to write articles about how obsessed WVU fans are... but it isn't OK for WVU fans to write articles in response?
You Michigan boys sure have a warped double standard. You tell us we should just keep quiet when you taunt us, but if we speak up it just proves what you are saying.
You know, this country has been living this same exact double speak for 6, 7 years now. Any time someone raises a contrary opinion, you have certain ideologues begging the question with ridiculous comments about aiding the enemy, and hating freedom. Sorry kids but this is a conversation that you folks (including Rich Rod) keep raising. Responding to your comments does not mean anything significant. It just means some fans have grown tired of the one sided press campaign that Michigan fans have been waging.
I am proud to see that most comments from WVU fans don't fall into the regular "insult" fest that most Michigan fans (and especially, many of the pro-Michigan Scribes) have started.
from about 1 month ago
It's "psycho" Joe. Brilliant analysis btw. I'd love to debate you on the real issues but you obviously can't go any deeper. At first I thought it was because you simply don't want to put Rodriguez under the microscope because you fear what you'll find. Now, from your post I understand a lot better. Rodriguez is a shiny object and you can't avert your eyes. lol.
from about 1 month ago
I'm an Illinois fan, not a Michigan fan, although I do have a lot of family that are Michigan fans. The reason that this article was written was because this guy still sees WVU fans getting worked up about the fact that Rodriguez left under bad circumstances. Bobby Petrino didn't get it this bad when he left Atlanta after just one season without seeing if he can really turn the ship around, and he only had bad things when he was there. At least Rodriguez brought your team into the spotlight. Also, I don't think Rodriguez is a good fit for Michigan this year, mainly because they lost out on Terrelle Pryor, so they don't have the duel threat QB that Rodriguez's system calls for, so I really think that this season, both teams will get a raw deal out of what he did.
from about 1 month ago
Disregard "the reason this article was written was because this guy still sees WVU fans getting worked up about the fact that Rodriguez left under bad circumstances." I'm tired and completely forgot what the article was about for a second. Also, the angry responses that I got are proof that WVU fans aren't over it. If you say that somebody isn't over something and they respond by yelling angrily "I'M OVER IT" they are obviously NOT over it.
from about 1 month ago
Why will you not explain to me how writing an article about the immaturity and hatefulness of some Michigan fans is proof I'm not over Rodriguez? Can you just answer that single question?
Why are you permitted to scream "You're not over it" repeatedly, like a toddler who's not getting his way, but when I deny it, that's proof that you're right? Could you answer THAT one?
That concept is a fallacy of the highest degree and you know it. The reason you're here is because you expect us to roll over and be your whipping boys. But, we keep bringing up the inconvenient fact that you guys might be the ones obsessing, so you keep coming back, because you can't move on.
If I'm wrong, then why do you keep coming back here and posting, days after the article was originally written?
I can't say it enough times, apparently. The opinions of WVU fans of your coach or your football team should NOT matter this much to you. You shouldn't need to come back here 3 or 4 different times trying to change our minds.
So, can you tell me why it does? Just answer a question for once, instead of just saying a little pat phrase about how we're still not over it. Show me you're thinking, not parroting phrases that you've heard from your friends or the media.
Just so there's no question, let me say it as clearly as possible. I wish Michigan nothing but success under their coach, Richard Rodriguez, and I harbor no feelings of ill will about him no longer being our coach. I am happy for Michigan that they got what they wanted, and am now looking forward to the new era of West Virginia football. I don't wring my hands over Rodriguez, Michigan, or anything else.
What DOES irritate me, is the ignorance and banality of people who insist that denial is proof of guilt, and the irrationality of Michigan fans who think repetition is argument, and their ideas should be accepted because they're Michigan. That's arrogance to the highest degree. They clearly need to move on.
"If you say that somebody isn't over something and they respond by yelling angrily "I'M OVER IT" they are obviously NOT over it."
If you repeatedly accuse anyone of something that's not true, why would you expect them to agree with you? What exactly, do you want us to do? Agree with you? You really claim to know better than us what we are thinking? Why the arrogance?
And, you know, if someone, months after the fact, keeps repeating, "It's just a business decision", "Psycho ex-girlfriend", and "We're Michigan", as if pleading with us to accept how wonderful and correct you all are, long after ANYONE still cared, then you clearly aren't over it, either.
The proof in that is that you have been here multiple times, casting your pearls before those you believe to be swine. Can you tell me why that is? What does WVU have to do with you, exactly?
Aren't you Michigan? Why do you care what little ol' WVU thinks?
from about 1 month ago
I am NOT a Michigan fan, and I stated that in my previous comment. Also, the fact that you are also coming back here to repost comments says something not only about me, but of you to if you want to say that. However, I don't think coming back here after the article is written is pathetic at all because it tells me when somebody replies to my comment it shows up in my play-by-play. I do think that WVU is probably going to be better, and this whole argument does not have anything to do with how good the football teams are, but of who is truly over it, and I really think that neither side is over it. As an outside party looking in, I continue to see arguments about who is truly over it, and I don't think either party is. Also, if nobody in WVU cares, why are WVU fans still trying so hard to prove that they don't care. Shouldn't being non-responsive say that you don't care, and replying with long, research filled comments be proof that you still need a little time before the Rich Rodriguez story is finally out of your mind.
from about 1 month ago
Joe ! Come on buddy !
In one breath you admit everybody still has a sore spot over this Rich Rod thing... and then you say WVU fans should just be quiet about it to show they are really done with the issue? Come on man, how fair is that ? You're trying to put out a fire with gasoline, using that kind of logic.
Look here... part of the reason why WVU fans are so vehement on boards like this is the plain fact that Rich Rod and Michigan have had the chance to speak to the nation about this on almost a weekly basis. Consequently, the whole nation is so busy listening to comments that WVU fans view as outright slander of our favorite school, that we are a bit touchy. Now... add all the articles and outright insults constantly posted by Michigan fans and what do you expect to get?
Here's a beginning of the solution. How about quit writing articles about Michigan and Rodriguez, and tagging them so that they show up when someone searches WVU football on this sports blog!
Fact... half the Michigan fans comments on this board have consisted of "Michigan is better than you". Yes, those folks have the long term record, but their recent performance has been less than what they are advertising.
Fact... WVU fans bad mouth Rodriguez. Michigan fans badmouth WVU. To borrow the "crazy ex-girlfriend" analogy, yes we may be the ex girlfriend, but we have 7 years of time, emotion, and money invested in the "ex-relationship". That gives us a history with the guy that Michigan does not have. That gives us a right to bad mouth the back stabbing, lying, self aggrandizing prick who is going around bad mouthing us. Long and the short of it is Michigan... get back to us when you have that much time invested in the relationship and only then will we think the corn and blue will have a right to say something.
And on the subject of investing in the relationship... Michigan can buy the right to back up RR in this fight. How? By paying off the bills he left behind. I am constantly put out when Michigan fans come mouthing off about tradition, and resources, and facilities, and it's only business. Yes, it is business. It is a business that involves contracts and legal obligations. Why do Michigan fans think that WVU should be ready to let RR out of his contract with WV? Does Michigan plan on letting their contract with RR be torn up... never to be enforced?
WVU has a tradition of its' own. A tradition that many people feel is somehow less important than Michigan's tradition. That is why every comment that WVU should have to prove we are "over it" is going to be shouted down.
One thing I would like to point out. Michigan keeps pointing out that it is somehow a better football team, based on its' long history of winning. I can't and wont deny Michigan its past glories. But I would like to see WVU and Michigan be pared together in a future series. Had we been playing matches for the past 5 seasons, I suspect that Michigan would not be so ready to claim that it is the superior program.
from about 1 month ago
"Also, if nobody in WVU cares, why are WVU fans still trying so hard to prove that they don't care."
I haven't tried to prove that. All I'm saying is that some Michigan fans aren't over it. And, I'm right.
from about 1 month ago
Anybody would be mad when somebody leaves a place where they have been for 7 years right before a bowl game and in the middle of a contract. I agree that Michigan fans are throwing gasoline onto the fire. But I think that you also need to realize that you aren't over it. I'm not saying that you should be over it or shouldn't, he did something shitty and anybody would be mad about it. Just don't say that you guys are over it then say that you are allowed some backstabbing and that is all your doing. You are entitled to backstabbing, hatred, and I would hope that Rodriguez gets a less than warm reception when he comes back to WVU as a Michigan coach. But trying to say that you are over it isn't right, just admit it, I don't think that it's wrong to be mad and post some hateful things, and I don't think Rodriguez is in the right with what he did.
from about 1 month ago
"You are entitled to backstabbing, hatred, and I would hope that Rodriguez gets a less than warm reception when he comes back to WVU as a Michigan coach."
You lost me here Joe. Most if not all of us, don't "hate" Rich Rod.
Saying we are "entitled to backstabbing" is also a bit confusing. "Backstabbing" is a traitorous, wrongful attack on someone with out provocation. If anyone can be accused of backstabbing someone, it would be Rich Rod.
Finally... RR will not be coming back to WVU as a Michigan coach. Not unless you know something about future game scheduling that the rest of us do not.
The importance you and others keep placing on the issue of whether WVU and its' fans are "over it" has become both irritating and boring. I don't know how many times I can repeat this... Michigan fans, and Rich Rod are the folks who are doing the most to keep this in the national spotlight. If you were to drive through Morgantown this week, you would be hard pressed to find a newspaper that mentions this, or a bar conversation about it. People here in WV simply don't talk about this as obsessively as some of you apparently think we do. If the subject was raised here, you would get the comment that we wish he would pay his buy out and leave us the hell alone.
The headlines here are more concerned with the WVU President, and whether he should step down from his position for academic wrongdoing and general inexperience when it comes to running a university.
from about 1 month ago
Lars is right. I long ago quit caring enough about Rod to do any backstabbing. It's just business.
You're the one still here talking about it as if we care. You really want to change our minds for SOME reason, because now, almost a full week after I wrote it, you're still here trying to convince us.
And, you're only an Illinois fan. Imagine some Michigan fans being 10X worse. You see now why we get fired up.
But that isn't directed at RR. It's directed at the people who bash us, as it should be. I don't care about RR. Just want that money for our football program, and for people to stop making up stupid statements about us.
from about 1 month ago
I misread your comment Lars, I thought you put that you were entitled to backstabbing, my mistake. But fine, you can say that you are over it, be my guest. I'm done trying to argue a useless point with you two. I don't really get why Michigan fans are so worked up at you guys, but I have said all that I have to say on the issue.
about 1 month ago
I never said I get angry about Michigan fans discussing Rodriguez. Show me where I did.
I said it's amazing how much you guys discuss WVU and their fans. Just like you did with this comment.
But, every time one of you guys come in here and start on us, it just reinforces what I said in the first place. You and your sidekick Ryan just can't let it go. It's sad.
about 1 month ago
A couple of the Michigan fans have said that we aren't rivals. They should be very thankful for that right now. Our football and basketball programs are on the national top 25 while theirs are currently mired in mediocrity. When looking at the sears cup challenge our latest ranking was 6 for all sports, which we have fewer of than any of the top ten. Michigan fans should worry about their nest 1AA opponent and give a break to wvu fans because they surely don't want to lose another home game to an Appy State. By the way, how's that basketball coach working out for ya'll?
about 1 month ago
Don't sweat Ryan... have you read the mindless drivel he writes? It's like arguing with the kid who wears the hockey helmet and takes the short bus to school.
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