Fighting in Junior Hockey—like all of these other "hot-button issues"— doesn't become hot-button until the wrong kind of publicity happens.
Two weeks ago it was Chris Pronger prodding the coals with his stomp on Ryan Kessler, which was followed by a suspension weaker than watered-down orange juice.
This week? It was Jonathan Roy and his legendary father St. Patrick that took the forefront in a playoff game in Chicoutimi, as they displayed actions disrespectful to the fans and even the game itself.
If you didn't see it, (and I'll be surprised if you didn't) then Patrick Roy (the coach of the Quebec Ramparts) allegedly (you won't get a straight answer on this) motioned to his son Jonathan during a brawl. Jonathan—a backup goalie for Quebec—skated across the ice and essentially mugged Chicoutimi goaltender Bobby Nadeau.
Now, a lot of times goalie fights are a thing of beauty—that's right I said beauty—they don't happen very often, but when they do, they're a treat.
However, this wasn't a fight.
Nadeau never waved Roy over, and wasn't wailing on any Chicoutimi players unfairly—he was standing there watching as Roy flew across the ice to pick a fight with him after turning down Roy's earlier invitation to 'dance.'
You could argue that Nadeau should have been prepared. Well, that's all in how you see it, and, frankly, the only way to know if Nadeau didn't notice Roy until it was too late or not is to be in Nadeau's mind as it's happening.
Following the younger Roy's win, he proceeded to skate the length of the ice, egging on the crowd with a barrage of middle fingers.
So should fighting be allowed in Junior Hockey?
Well let's get one things straight: This was not a fight. It was a one-sided slaughter.
Bench-clearing brawls happen—not often, but they do, and no one says a thing except "let's see that again."
Goalie fights happen and no one does anything except create a top 10 list of the best goalie fights in history.
All of the sudden a kid blazes across the ice to assault an unassuming opponent and that's a fight? Obviously, I'm missing a step here.
Second of all: Of all of these people who are pining for a ban on fighting in Junior Hockey—how many "fights" other than this one have they seen?
If anything, fighting in the junior ranks is gone about in a more respectable way than in the NHL. How many NHL players start with the two players taking off their helmets, spacing themselves and then going at it? Then think of how many start with one guy just grabbing the other and punching.
Hell, in Junior C, the players have to take their opponent's helmets off if they want to fight. Sure, it's in an effort to avoid a suspension, but that's respect if I ever saw it.
That's not to say that every fight in junior starts fairly, or every fight in the NHL starts unfairly—however, whether it's because there's visors on the helmets or not, these muggings and discipline issues happen far more frequently at the NHL level than the OHL level.
If I'm Gary Bettman, that's embarrassing.
If I'm David Branch and the CHL, I'm happy the kids are learning to it respectably.
12 comments Last one added about 1 year ago — Leave a Comment
Miah D. about 1 year ago
fighting in the junior is part of the preparation for the NHL. as u say, if one day the kid will be face to face to guys like Laraque, I dont think he is gonna ever survive the experience!
not only a fighter like Laraque...just take any big huge guy in the league. everytime a fight will start, the little boy will freak out and cry to his coach that he cannot handle violence and rivalry in hockey, and that everyone should be friendly and play it nice and soft like he has been taught!
just take a look at Montreal Sergei Kostitsyn, he has been taught to fight in his junior hockey by his coaches and look how he is all imposing his rythm and having some nice rights and lefts when he fights.
good article!
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Emily Hartig about 1 year ago
Nice job!
I have to say I'm partial to your article and opinion because my boyfriend is a Junior Penguins C-level coach. They just went to Nationals in Massachusetts, but, unfortunately are heading home early tomorrow.
I've seen them win big, and I've seen them get their collective asses beat. And, when that happened, the boys took it upon themselves to save their prides and say, "well, if we can't beat 'em, we might as well beat up on 'em."
If they truly want to be NHL players, they know it's a part of the game, too. They should be able to defend themselves if they want a future in the game because no one's ever gonna take it easy on them or pity them.
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Anonymous about 1 year ago
Check out M.Macdonald-Halls article for a great analylis of what fighting has brought to some of the "Better" teams in this years NHL. To ban fighting would eliminate an aspect of the game that makes hockey hockey.
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William North about 1 year ago
Why would you even propose changing what is an already wonderful game...there have already been too many rule changes that have given the game shame. Fighting has been the only way for men and boys to settle momentary disagreements that occur during the heated moent on the ice....Those who have played the game at any level know un-equivicolly that 99% of the time their are no innocent players on the ice....even Wayne Gretzky has been guilty of "dirty play". To take the actions of a young adrenaline driven J.Roy from that one particular game is very simple and then to write an article such as this to keep receiving feedback is not only Bush league its juvenile...Learn the finer points of a game before preaching to others...what a joke
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Anonymous about 1 year ago
On second thought may-be I was a little too tough....I should have taken off the gloves first and tipped my helmet...sorry.
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Joe Sakic about 1 year ago
Dont worry people. Its all non hockey fans who want fighting gone.
Roy is a bonehead. This doesnt mean fighting goes.
and well other then young Roy's attack of the other goalie those line brawls are very entertaining.
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Miah D. about 1 year ago
the crowd cheers for 1)scoring 2)goalie save 3)fighting 4)hitting
I am even wondering if goalie save should not come 4th, after hitting ...
it is definitely part of the game, they even have the "gordie howe hat trick" ! if they ban fighting, the hockey won't be hockey anymore but called figure skating, Gordie Howe will get sad, and one or two players per team will lose their jobs!
Montreal Guy Carbonneau declared he won't be against non-violent hockey, and that a team like the Habs don't need a "fighter", he also added that violence is not what attracts people into watching hockey...
ah come on... that is...funny!
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Derek Harmsworth about 1 year ago
Fighting is a great part of the game, but like Bryan says, this was not a fight, it was an attack.
To me Jonathan should have gotten like 12 games. Let me explain quick (I would write a whole article, but I can't top this article if I try.)
--Two games for instigating. Normally in the NHL Instigating a fight can get you a one game suspension. But this wasn't a fight, it was a borderline assault on skates. He ignored both the physical and verbal warnings of the officials, so I would give him two.
--Eight games for the "fight" itself. Roy went all the way down the ice, from one crease to the next, skating nearly 200 feet, so clearly it wasn't a 'in the moment' thing, we could all agree it was somewhat premeditated. Also it was clear the other goalie didn't want anything to do with a fight. And further more, in a fight where you are clearly tougher than the opponent, and the opponent doesn't want to fight, you simply hit him a few times, knock him around, then take him to the ice, proving your point. Instead, the young Roy pummled his opponent, threw him to the ice, and continued to pound him on the ice. Pretty disgraceful if you ask me.
--Two games for the finger flipping and post fight shenanigans. The CHL (and all junior hockey in general) is used as a grounds to train these players how to behave and represent their team and their league, both on and off the ice. Giving the middle finger to the fans, other players and everyone else in attendance was a pretty poor decision (one of many I guess.) Put it this way, What if that other goaltenders parents were in the crowd. Not only did they unfortunately see their son violently attacked, but they were also disrespected by the purpetraitor. In NHL and NFL a middle finger gesture usually gets maybe one game and a fine. Since you can't fine a junior player, I tacked on two games.
Anyways, my two cents. Great article Bryan, as always.
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Sean Crowe about 1 year ago
I'm still wondering if the other goalie knows that he was allowed to fight back....
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MJ Kasprzak about 1 year ago
Seeing Jr. Roy continue to beat a man who is not fighting back was worse than seeing Bertuzzi attack Moore from behind--in fact, I wouldn't even beat Bertuzzi that badly. Patty was my favourite goalie, but after he did that, and has not come out strong that the resulting massacre showed him the error of his ways, I can no longer be a fan of his.
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Anonymous about 1 year ago
what bertuzzi did and jonathan roy did were about the same: to give the other guy a lesson. the thing is, Moore ended on a stretcher and never could get back to the game, while Nadeau was put back in the net the game after.
but for sure, that was NOT fighting...that was some stupid wrong decision taken by Roy and his son, but is not qualified as a fight.
actually, I think Nadeau did not want to fight back so he would not get suspended or something. poor guy...he did not get his mojo back since then.
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Ken Armer about 1 year ago
Juniors and fighting go together like a Roy kicking the crap outta the opposing goalie!
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