The release of the 2008 edition of the USA Today Coaches Poll got me thinking. Why do the coaches get to vote for the best team, but the players don’t get to vote for the best coach?
I would love to see a weekly ranking of the best coaches in college football today. Sure it doesn’t make much sense in the grand scheme of things, but it sure is interesting.
So, I’ve decided that this college football season there will be a Top 25 for coaches. Sure it is purely subjective at the beginning of the season (much like the other polls), but as the season moves forward so will the poll.
It will work much like the other weekly polls…you lose, you drop. A win over another ranked coach counts for more than a win over an unranked coach, and well…you get the idea.
How did I choose the pre-season top 25? Like the other polls the decisions were based on the coaches reputation, their success last season, and a perceived expectation of what they could accomplish this season.
So without further adieu…The 2008 Top 25 College Football Coaches Rankings (Week One Edition).
33 comments Last one added 10 months ago — Leave a Comment
Mitch at sportschatplace.com 10 months ago
Ummm...
Rich Rod after a home loss is 12 but Rick Neuheisal wins as a 7 point dog and is unranked? Rich Brooks wins a rivalry game as an underdog on the road and is nowhere?? A bunch of guys that beat 1-aa teams ahead of those 2??
If Skip Holtz isn't in this week he'll never be.
Jim Grobe is one of the best in the game....Paul Johnson as well.
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Kristofer Green 10 months ago
Rodriguez did drop from the preseason rankings. I guess I couldn't see dropping him much further, but am receiving feedback that maybe I should have.
Nueheisel will definitely work his way up. He wasn't even on the radar before last night.
I guess I'm not as impressed with the KY win as you were. Yes they beat a rival on the road, but the rival they beat was not very good. The KY defense impressed me, I will give them that. But I'm not so sure the Louisville offense is all that great. I could be wrong. I've been wrong before. He certainley will have the opportunity to work his way onto the list.
Skip Holtz will be able to work he way up as well. This isn't just for the "big boy" universities.
Grobe and Johnson are both fine coaches and will have their opporunities. The season is very young.
Like I said in the article, I will use all the comments received to help me determine rankings. I can already see there will be some changes next week. Stay tuned.
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Mitch at sportschatplace.com 10 months ago
Ok, I though I was missing the point but actually this is just something we fundamentally disagree on and I can live with it. While it has no bearing on your stuff I will sum up my perspective on coaching.
THE WORLD ACCORDING TO MITCH
There are schools out there who just by their very name and coaches who once coached there who are blessed with a funnel to capture the talent pool. There are other schools who recruit coaches who can dig through the mines and scrape through the left overs to find diamonds in the rough. While you need a firm hand and good mind to make the first work, you need to be an awesome coach to win with inferior talent. Guys like Jim Grobe, Paul Johnson, Frank Beamer, Rich Brooks, Dan Hawkins are great coaches. Guys like Jim Tressel, Les Miles, Urban Meyer, etc. didn't all of the sudden become national title winning coaches, the ywent to schools that get all of the talent. The greatest coaches of all time are the ones who transition their schools from a scraper to a funnel(see: Bowden, Bobby or Paterno, Joe). While you may not be impressed with the Kentucky (yet you are thrilled with a bunch of guys who beat JV teams) he gets about 10th choice in his area of the country in the talent pool if even that. Grobe is even lower.
I think you are looking at team rankings and not the job of the guy running the ship. And that is the world according to Mitch.
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Kristofer Green 10 months ago
I can agree with that your take. But in my defense I would say it takes a certain amount of coaching ability to sustain a success level. And though I agree with the statement coaches who can win with inferior talent are awesome coaches, Jim Tressel, Urban Meyer, and Les Miles have all proved they could do that too (Youngstown State, Utah, and Oklahoma State.)
Am I saying that Jim Grobe and Rich Brooks couldn't win if they were at an Ohio State or Florida? No. But in this day age, with more and more top recruits picking non brand name schools, the playing field is a little more even. Is it completely even, no. But Jim Grobe and Rich Brooks have just as good a chance as anyone else at a recruit. It comes down to recruiting ability to a certain extent.
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Mitch at sportschatplace.com 10 months ago
it really isn't close at all. I admit they'll pick up a top guy here and there but they get the leftovers for the most part, just the way it is. Tressel won at Youngstown, Les Miles at Ok. State and Meyer at Utah but they were 3 or 4 loss guys with the exception of Tressel whose school played JV, by this system the wouldn't rank. Maintaining the program is hard, John Cooper at OSU, Gerry Dinardo at LSU, it goes on and on but over all a guy who can either win with less or turn a loser into a respected and perennial power like Bobby Bowden and Howard Schnellenberger (3 times) have done is amazing.
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Molly Gray 10 months ago
I've never been a UCLA fan, in fact I've always disliked them, but I found myself rooting for them whole-heartedly yesterday because of Neuheisal, you've got to get him WAY up there! And I agree with miamimitch, get Rich Rod out of there! But this is a great concept, can't wait to keep up with the installments.
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Kristofer Green 10 months ago
I totally agree. I've never been a UCLA fan either but I'm gonna follow them much closer this season. I really didn't have an opinion on Nueheisel before last night. But I liked the way he coached Kevin Craft. I don't know that I've ever seen such a drastic change in a quarterback from one half to the other. Norm Chow is maybe the best OC in the business and he called a perfect second half. It was a great game.
You're not the only one saying to drop RichRod. Like I told Mitch, I'll use the comments and input to help me form the poll from week to week. So... I can already see some changes on the horizon.
BTW, thanks for the edit! I appreciate it!
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Robert 10 months ago
Rich Rod didn't look any better than Lloyd Carr to me, maybe worse.
Interesting list. No complaints.
Good read, Kristopher...
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Kristofer Green 10 months ago
You're the third person to tell me Rich Rod is too high. Look for a drop next week (unless Michigan suddenly gets it), which isn't going to happen. They should be able to handle Miami (OH), but you just never know!
Thanks for the comments! Look for the rankings every week. I use the comments to help me form the list!
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Robert 10 months ago
Kristofer,
Meechigan looked really similar to Tennessee. Sort of like a dart with no feathers...
Both teams seemed to lack direction. One possession they're running short dumps over the middle and in space. Running with some direction and having success. Then the next possession, they're spread all across the field tossing around the ball like they get 5 downs. Michigan has some serious problems. For some reason, I just get the sneaking suspicion that Pat White is solely responsible for Rich Rod's recent success. But who knows...it's just 1 week in.
Heck, they beat the Dawgs under Richy.
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BabyTate 10 months ago
Excellent point Robert. Carr won a national championship. Rodriguez's fold up in the final game versus Pittsburgh last year was stunningly inept.
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Rob Sansing 10 months ago
I don't like Alabama, but based on the results of the first week, Nick Saban should be #1.
(#12. Rich Rodriguez. Is that a joke???)
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Kristofer Green 10 months ago
Rich Rod will drop next week. I guess I'm too kind. Duely noted about Saban. I would say the top 4 are all pretty even in terms of coaching ability, recruiting, and the like. Saban is definitely one of the best coaches out there.
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J.C. Ayvazi 10 months ago
Like your premise here Kristofer—I'll be checking each week.
Like all the others, I think RR got to go. Remember The Soprano's and Big Pussy?
While you are at it, slid a couple of dumbbells into Phil Fulmer's pants.
Pat Hill and Skip Holtz should have gotten a better bounce, ya got Olympic gymnastic judges working with you or what 8^D
Does a coach get bonus points for a meltdown like Oklahoma State's Gundy last year?
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Kristofer Green 10 months ago
Thanks J.C.
Rod is dropping. For sure. Pat Hill and Skip Holtz will both have another chance to move up this week as they face Wisconsin and West Virginia.
A proper meltdown should get some sort of bonus, what that is I'm not so sure. :)
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James Roth 10 months ago
Hey - What about some love for the MAC? Gregg Brandon of Bowling Green ought to be on this list after their win over Dave Wannstadt and #24 ranked Pittsburgh.
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Kristofer Green 10 months ago
He just missed. If I expanded the others receiving votes portion he would have been there. I'm keeping my eye on BG. Thanks!
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Carson Howell 10 months ago
The "ole ball coach", Steve Spurrier, SHOULD be ranked higher. Not only will he go down as one of the greatest coaches of all time, if your basing this article off 1st week performances, USC did shut out a 1-A squad by 34.
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Kristofer Green 10 months ago
Noted. Spurrier did move up 3 spots.
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Carson Howell 10 months ago
The "ole ball coach", Steve Spurrier, SHOULD be ranked higher. Not only will he go down as one of the greatest coaches of all time, if your basing this article off 1st week performances, USC did shut out a 1-A squad by 34.
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Nick The Only 10 months ago
I wouldn't put Tressel ahead of Meyer for several reasons:
1. Meyer beat Tressel head-to-head when Tressel's team was the overwhelming favorite.
2. Tressel has lost 2 straight National Championships. Meyer is 1-0 in national title games.
3. Tressel easily beats teams in his own conference, but then gets blown out by quality OOC teams in big games.
4. Tressel's only national title win was due more to the refs than anything else.
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Dan Boss 10 months ago
1. I'll give you this one.
2. Tressel was 1-0 as well. Meyer needs to make two more appearances to even compare them.
3. Your trying to extend on #2. Tressel's teams have won every big OOC game besides two of the NC games and once to Texas with no starting QB. They beat #2 Texas in Texas two seasons ago and beat a very good North Carolina State team a few years ago. I wouldn't even consider losing by 14 to LSU a blowout. Thats like losing by six points in basketball. It's only a two possession game.
4. The jugernaut offense of Miami Fl. that had won the NC the season before and was undefeated again had 1st and goal and couldn't score. Tressel's defense had nothing to do with that game, only the ref's right? Besides, that would have nothing to do with ranking coaches, a win is a win. If USC beat Virginia this week because of the refs, would they fall in the polls? Nope.
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Kristofer Green 10 months ago
I can understand your point on #1.
#2 Getting to three NC games in three years is pretty impressive.
#3 One blowout. LSU wasn't a blowout. A 2 posession game isn't a blowout.
#4 Or the fact that Miami was stopped on 4th and goal.
We'll see how it goes. Is there really that big a diffeence between 2 and 3?
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Kristofer Green 10 months ago
***I meant getting to three NC games in 6 years is pretty impressive.
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Michael Bergman 10 months ago
Ummmm.... ok. I guess so.
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Kristofer Green 10 months ago
ha.
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Jim Fleer 10 months ago
IMO, Rich Rodrigez and Frank Beamer should both drop much more than they did after their week one performances. I have to agree with Mike Leach moving into the rankings - he did well to defeat his defensive coordinator and "pull" out the victory over directional Washington.
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JJ Gildersneeze 10 months ago
There's not an AD in the country that wouldn't take Mike Belotti over Dennis Erickson or Bob Stoops.
JJ
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Ryan Staab 10 months ago
I'm curious to see how far Brian Kelley will fall after the Bearcats get manhandled by Oklahoma next week.
Love the concept of this coaches poll, though. Great work as always Kris!
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Jacob Bridges 10 months ago
I think that Cincinnati team you mentioned might surprise a few people including yourself. Though I do not think they will come into Norman and win, I do think Oklahoma should not look past the tough Bearcats. Mike Mickens is one of the better DBs in the country, and this defense is rock solid. I'm thinking these boys from UC won't be a cupcake like everyone thinks. Kelley is a great coach, and unfortunately, I do not think he will be at UC long before a top tier program snatches him up.
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Daniel Spurgeon 10 months ago
Nice concept for an article. I liked the fact that you included several coaches that don't get as much media attention as others- such as Jim Leavitt, Gary Pinkel, Pat Hill, and Jim Grobe. I am also a big Mike Leach fan- perhaps because of his eccentricies- and because he stays true to his ideas of how to play football.
However, I don't see Charlie Weiss on the list. (And nor do I think that he should be on the list- unless Notre Dame shows a lot of improvement this year.) My point being this, two years ago, after his great season- he would have been at or near the top of many writer's top coaches lists. After last year, not so much. My guess is that he was still coaching the same- but when the talent level of his team was much greater than the talent of other teams- perhaps it showed that he was winning because of superior talent- not because of superior coaching.
The products that I look for from a coach (other than W's of course) are for his players to work hard and then to go out and play with intensity and passion. I think the top 11 coaches in your list do that. For another coach (a coach not on your list) that I believe usually has his team inspired and ready to play is Bobby Johnson of Vanderbilt. Vanderbilt has beaten a few top SEC teams in recent years- and took Georgia to the wire last year. Vanderbilt is seriously mismatched in terms of talent- but not in intensity or heart. Rich Brooks of Kentucky is similar. Kentucky knocking off #1 LSU last year was an impressive win.
Great article, Kris.
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BabyTate 10 months ago
Bobby Johnson played football at Clemson.
Bobby Johnson was headcoach of Furman when they went to the National Championship game.
Bobby Johnson runs a clean program that defeats better teams.
You make a great point about Johnson. One can't help but wonder how he would do if he had the talent of his alma mater this season.
Jim Grobe's coaching techniques are so mysterious that other teams don't know what just happened when they lose to Wake Forest. Another great point, Daniel.
Leach has genius tendency. He sometimes overthinks and loses but he's a terrific coach. Another great point.
Really excellent comment .
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brice tyler 10 months ago
Mitch,
So where do you categorize a coach like Carrol who has elevated his program? Currently, the argument could easily be made that he is winning because of the talent that he gets into the program. But what about the 10 years prior to him coaching at SC? They weren't dominant. Not even of UCLA in the same town. So how do you separate pure coaching ability from the ability to recruit and then establish a stream of talent with which you can win? I agree with your points about the above rankings entirely. I just wonder what your thoughts are about what is considered coaching. In the college ranks, do you consider superior skill in recruiting kids, that will fit into and stay at a program, part of being a great coach? If so, do you then gauge a coach by maintaining recruiting, the change of recruiting classes etc? Look at ND...TW was there and much of the downhill has been attributed, by some, as poor recruiting during TW's days. Would you agree that that has effected CW and his ability to coach? Or is he just not for the college ranks? My thoughts are that recruiting, especially in college, is paramount to success. If you can recruit and coach...you win championships. Obviously, being at a school that can recruit annually is a major advantage. But, look at WV, UCLA, ASU, Mizzou on the upside and look at Miami, ND, Nebraska and FSU as some example of traditional talent magnets that have slipped.
Brice
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