Dominic DeNucci on Biggest Mistake Made by Wrestlers Today, McMahon and More

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“Plain english, Vince McMahon don't like me, okay. Vince McMahon don't like Italian, Spanish, he don't like anything but himself.” -Dominic DeNucci

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Straightforward words with a thick but genuine Italian accent, spoken by wrestling legend Dominic DeNucci. I first had the pleasure of meeting DeNucci in December at a roast and lunch for him, where it was announced he would be inducted in the Pro Wrestling Hall of Fame in Amsterdam, New York in May.

In every conversation I've had with the legend, telling you how he feels is something DeNucci will always do. If he doesn't tell you how he feels, he just won't talk to you (we'll get to that later).

DeNucci wasn't trying to make a rant about McMahon, but the main theme of a majority of the interview was "yesterday in the business versus today." I asked DeNucci if he ever gets asked by WWE to do any business in any capacity with them, which prompted his comments about his relationship with McMahon.

He did go on to say when he has seen McMahon in the past when WWE visits Pittsburgh, where DeNucci resides, and McMahon is very cordial and friendly.

“I see him once and a while, I saw him at arena in Pittsburgh and we look like we are friends and that's fine, cause that's the way it is,” said DeNucci.

It was this kind of honesty DeNucci gave in an hour interview he did in studio on TribLIVE Radio in Pittsburgh on Tuesday, April 24th.

Also in studio was long-time wrestling and now-Pittsburgh-based promoter Ken “Lord Zoltan” Jugan. He never got to the heights DeNucci did in his wrestling career as a performer, but Jugan did have notable matches in the '80s for WWF against names such as The Iron Sheik and Andre The Giant.

Listening back to the interview, we were analyzing as many aspects of the wrestling business we had time to get to and looking at the changes over the decades. 

Says DeNucci, “There's no more wrestling with what they're doing.” 

DeNucci talked about a trend of faster matches where the guys don't slow down and let the audience react naturally, missing a lot of the psychology. Some comments were being made by Ken Jugan and Dominic would nod his head in agreement.

One of the biggest issues DeNucci and Jugan said they have with how the wrestlers are different as performers is they are playing the role of a wrestler, but not actually wrestling. They talked about guys today planning for an hour in the locker room a five-minute match. Guys will plan move-for-move, rather than trying to work the reactions of the crowd.

“A lot of the guys now are performing for themselves rather than the fans,” Ken Jugan said.

DeNucci and Jugan both acknowledge guys such as CM Punk and Daniel Bryan being some of the shining stars who know how to entertain but also know the craft of wrestling. Overall, they feel there are a lot of guys on all levels of the business who try to do too much too quickly.

“Even wrestling against Dominic, we've had matches where the guys are ready to jump in the ring and we haven't even touched each other,” said Jugan.

While DeNucci and Jugan talked about matches being a spot fest with wrestlers looking for the next “Holy you-know-what” moment, I had to bring up Mick Foley.

Foley was a part of the first class of wrestlers ever trained by Dominic DeNucci. Both men still speak today and have a very good relationship. DeNucci talked about how Foley, who he calls “Micky" is a good man and has made a good living in the business.

He went on to say he always thinks Foley is a smart guy, but on the night that of what is probably Foley's career-defining moment, DeNucci had to tell him otherwise. 

In June of 1998, Mick Foley got tossed off the Hell in a Cell cage by The Undertaker in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. DeNucci says Foley didn't know he was there in attendance.

DeNucci says when he saw what Foley did in that match, he said to Micky, “You're not a smart man, you have to be complete idiot.”

14 years later, DeNucci is laughing as he tells me this, but says that was his true opinion that night. He didn't want to see Foley make a living with those kinds of stunts and not be able to walk on his own 20 years down the line.

Both DeNucci and Jugan repeatedly stressed being able to do less but knowing how to get the audience and their emotions invested in the story.

It wasn't the first time I had heard from ring veterans about the power of calling your matches in the ring and that less is more. However, this was the best in-depth explanation and evaluation of how to work a match.

I couldn't help but think of John Cena, the top guy in wrestling today who draws the biggest reaction, one way or the other. Much of the criticism Cena gets from fans who don't like him is his in-ring performance—the classic “five moves of doom” line and chants of “You can't wrestle.”

I recall a former WWE announcer telling me months ago how John Cena likes to call his matches in the ring and a lot of guys on the WWE roster get frustrated with that, preferring to plan out what moves they will do beforehand.

When you take what we know and see from Cena, add in the words of wisdom from a wrestling legend like DeNucci, you can see some of the inside-the-ring recipe of what makes Cena a guy who's risen to the top of the business.

Cena portrays a character that is very much him. It wasn't given to him or written for him; it's just him. He can get the audience to a fever pitch with very little physicality and will pull out a move based on their reaction.

“When you wrestle in the ring, people give you a response if you do the right thing,” said DeNucci.

Before we ended the interview, DeNucci made us laugh with talking about going to independent wrestling shows and watching younger wrestlers' matches. He admits he likes some of what he sees and enjoys helping improve those stars in any way can with advice.

He also admitted to what drives him crazy.

One thing I can't stand, before they go in the ring, they start clapping their hands so the people have to do that," DeNucci said. "I would take that guy and turn him upside down, stick him in the garbage can. Why do you tell the people they have to do that, if they like it they do. I can't stand it.”

DeNucci comically recalled a young independent wrestler who asked him to watch his match and the he did.

This was an example of DeNucci either saying what he thinks or just not talking to you: “I told the kid, I'll talk to you later. I didn't want to tell him, didn't want to insult him. I wanted to slap him first."

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To see more of Ken "Lord Zoltan" Jugan's work as a performer and promoter, check out Keystone State Wrestling Alliance.