Garnett Trade: Kevin Garnett Debate Rages in Boston

Since my sophomore year of high school, I've been a loyal member of a fantasy baseball league populated entirely by native Bostonians.

Needless to say, there was some healthy debate when word leaked of the impending Kevin Garnett trade.
 
My aim here is to bring that debate to a wider audience. The names have been changed to protect the innocent.
 

S began the conversation with an innocuous comment about the value of the trade:

This trade makes the Boston Celtics relevant THIS year. We have been terrible for fifteen years and Ainge has been hoarding talent, bringing in point guard after point guard, for what: to bring together enough talent to get a top five player in the league (not just at his position).

So what if we make a 2 or 3 year run and then are horrible. Waiting for Jefferson, Rondo, et al to mature while slowly wasting Paul Pierce's prime would not have been rewarding. In four years with Pierce at 33 and Jefferson a top five power forward, we would have been home grown, but we still wouldn t have raised a banner.

This trade gives us the opportunity to win a championship and that is the ultimate goal. Why wait patiently like watching whiskey distill hoping that our batch of players matures. We can win now with cool players. It's not like we traded for Jermaine O'Neil and Jamal Crawford; we have Garnett and Jesus Shuttlesworth (Ray Allen in He Got Game), who are two class acts that are exciting to root for.

I can understand if this was a baseball deal and we gave next to nothing to take on a big salary because we are a major market team, but this maneuver by Ainge was well crafted.

Have fun being bitter about another sports story, add it to the list, but I'm going to enjoy watching Celtics basketball THIS year. Maybe if I'm lucky, one of the refs will be making sure the C's win...

 

 

G, a strong believer in the value of youth, disagreed:

I STRENUOUSLY OBJECT.

I don't have time to go into it now, but the Celtics will compete for the East this year, agreed. I do NOT think they have the talent to win the NBA title. Chemistry in basketball is at LEAST as important in baseball, if not more. You can't just throw a bunch of stars together and expect to win. The amount of talent Ainge shipped off for Ray Allen and Garnett is ludicrous for two guys who are not getting any better at this point in their careers. I would say that NONE of the three is in his prime anymore....

I guess I did go into it a little bit.

J, the biggest Celtics fan of us all, surprisingly approved of the deal:

I love Al Jefferson, LOVE him. I think he is going to be one of the best players in the league in a few years ... but one thing you have to remember is that he only had 2 more years on his contract with the Celtics ... and why would anyone want to re-sign with the CELTICS? They are awful.

S used the word "relevant" and I think that's the most important thing here. Even if this team does not win (and I do think they will have a legit shot), the Celtics are a team that people will be interested in again. And that is something that they have not achieved since we were in diapers. Seriously.

Do you know how many times my dad (who lives in Florida) got to see the Celtics play last year? Twice. When they played the Heat. Not ONE national game. And then you wonder why big names are refusing to go to Boston. Now when the Celtics go after a free agent the guys will be thinking "Hey, there's a competitive team," because no matter what, this deal will make them competitive for the next 2-3 years.

I also really like the way that our starters complement one another now we've got the slasher (Pierce), the shooter (Allen), and the inside presence (KG)...plus Rondo is going to be improved and I really like his game and all that Kendrick Perkins will need to do is be a big body, box out, and rebound. I would say that we have the best team in the East now.

Can we compete against the West? Maybe not, but if we are playing well we could conceivably grab another veteran to come off the bench and that could be the kicker. I am VERY worried about our bench, it's incredibly shallow after giving up all those guys...but this is going to be the most fun Celtics team that any of us have ever rooted for (and don't give me some BS that you remember the '86 Celtics...you had just recently stopped sucking on your mom's boobies at that time).

S, who works for a company owned by the Red Sox organization:

I know someone in the Ticket Office at the Celtics and ticket sales were at a 15-year low at this point in the offseason. NO ONE wanted to go to Celtics games. No fans at games = no ticket income and a smaller audience to provide value to sponsors = less revenue = management less willing to spend money on team = terrible product on court = even lower ticket income and sponsorship revenue = pathetic franchise with no fans and no reason for any NBA player to join the team.

Sometimes we have to make decisions for TODAY rather than waiting for some idyllic future when the Celtics are all of a sudden better again. Jefferson, an aging Pierce, and some of our young talent that maybe might possibly develop doesn't fill the seats, get time on national television, or go deep into the playoffs.

The difference between the Celtics and the Red Sox? The Celtics offer business clients the ability to get a third suite game rental for free if you buy two games. The Red Sox? The Red Sox have every suite holder in a ten-year commitment for every game plus a ten-year waiting list. Why? They have David Ortiz, Manny, Matsuzaka, and the hottest team in town. In the 80s the Celtics were the hottest team in town, and this trade is a step back in that direction.

  

R:

I am admittedly TERRIBLE at making decisions when it comes to trades, and I agree that chemistry is a must for any team to win, but I think this exception isn't about a bunch of young All-Stars who are all going to play for themselves. These are a bunch of vets who want to win, KG probably the most of all of them. That one year the Wolves made a run in the playoffs he was about as passionate as I've seen any player be. I just think it's going to be insanely fun watching all of them this year.

The biggest thing that the Celtics have done is synchronized the team. Before they were half development half veteran so Pierce was waiting around for these VERY young guys to develop while he was getting older. Now at least they are synchronized in terms of yes the team is going to need to rebuild for a few years after these guys all leave but for a few years they are going to be fun to watch before going back through the cycle of drafting and getting players again...instead of the other side, watching Pierce crumble to nothing and then having to re-sign all our young talent right as Pierce is pretty much done.

W, a diehard sports cynic in the great Boston tradition:

I don't really have all the time in the world to go into it, but I would bullet a few points.

1) Just to get this off my chest, there is nothing that pisses me off MORE than comments about Telfair. Yes, I am glad to see him go too, but you can't congratulate Ainge for dumping a guy 1 year after he invested salary and a top-7 pick in him!!!! It's like, good job Danny, you really cut your losses there pal. That was a moronic move in the first place, he doesn't get kudos for then finding a semi-realistic way to get rid of him.

2) I love Kevin Garnett and the thought of him sweating it up in the TD BankNorth Gahden with a crisp #21 Celtics jersey on clearly gets me excited. I just want to make that clear.

3) Lastly, because I don't have the time right now, I guess my main hatred with this deal is the philosophical hypocrisy it shows. I know our system wasn't working and I know that despite our efforts we had really made no significant gains in the last 5 years following the "let's draft and develop" philosophy...but it just seems shortsighted and like a cop out to me.

We will most certainly be in the Eastern Conference Finals I would imagine, and I agree with all of the points regarding ticket sales and relevancy (because when you start to lose fans, isn't that the beginning of the end anyway??), but I honestly think we will go back to being the worst team in the NBA in about 3 years. I really do. And if we win a title, that will be great, but it won't change the fact that Boston is a baseball city with a world class football organization. The Celtics will fall right back to being irrelevant when we don't have a semblance of young talent nor a god GM in 3 years. That will be fun.

So all in all, the Celtics will be terrible for about 10 and good for 3 from the span of 2003-2016. Cool.

One more thing: you know what wins basketball games? You know what makes the Spurs and Suns and Mavs better than other teams, besides their talent and execution? COACHING. Is Danny really rolling out Doc Rivers to coach this Dream Team? The sentiment was that Doc was a very good developer and was patient and perfect for the type of team Ainge was bringing along. Now? Now Rivers is going to be simply overwhelmed with his own squad. He is a god awful coach who shouldn't have a job. If you put together THIS team, and then ask Rivers to guide it, that's like building the best fighter jet in the world and then asking the Greased Up Deaf Guy to fly it into battle. Have fun with that. If we don't get a new coach, these moves are 20-30% less effective.

D:

Until the Sox and Pats are terrible, the Celtics have no control over whether they are the hottest team in town. That said, if they win, you better believe there will be asses in the seats. This is still Boston, one of the hottest sports hubs in the country with one of the most diehard, knowledgeable fan bases you'll find. We don't need the Sox and Pats to be irrelevant before ticket sales go up for the Celts. We need the Celts to have an exciting, winning team.

W:

Just look at what we gave up for two players in the their early 30s, on the tail end of their careers:

Al Jefferson (top 5 PF right now)
Gerald Green (draws McGrady comparisons on offense, can't play a lick of D)
Theo Ratliff (a big part of Ainge's fucking ingenious MIN deal involving Wally, due to his expiring deal)
Ryan Gomes (SOLID, young bench player only getting better)
Delonte West (SOLID, young #2 guard only getting better)
Sabby Telfair (equal to #7 overall and just over $8 million in cap space)
1st Round pick (Jeff Green, or whoever we wanted out of Yi, Brewer et al. if we had kept the pick)
1st Round pick
1st Round pick
Around half of Kevin Garnett's $6.75 million trade kicker

...None of you see anything wrong with that? Danny just threw the kitchen sink and roughly two starting 5s at two aging players. Let's all be honest with ourselves here: The Boston Celtics are being run by a toddler, in diapers, who doesn't have a clue what's going on. Just admit it and we can all be happier.

Ainge had no plan and was exposed as such on lottery night when he lost out on Oden or Durant. That was his winning move, his ace up the sleeve: to land one of those kids. When he didn't, he knew the only way to save face was a) abandon all the kids he had drafted, traded for, and developed, b) surround Pierce with old, experienced vets NOW, and c) completely jump ship on the philosophy he had preached over the course of the last 5 years.

He has done just that. I would have much rather given up Gerald Green and a pick for Andrei Kirilenko and moved forward next year. I will root for the Celtics cuz they are my basketball team, but am quite honestly appalled that Danny Ainge has done nothing but bad things and is somehow getting congrats for it.

D:

I don't think anyone is saying that Ainge is a genius. Far from it. But not every plan works and sometimes you have to give a guy credit for admitting his mistakes (if only through action) and cutting his losses when he can still salvage a chance at short-term excitement and success, rather than sinking the ship completely because he has to much pride to admit that his original plan was failing.

I agree that he would probably be charging forward with his plan had we landed Oden or Durant...who would probably have been one of the final pieces of the puzzle to make the past 5 years look smart, or at least worth it. But the reality is we didn't get them. So Ainge could have plowed forward with his plan as if an Oden/Durant weren't a key component and possibly driven it the entire franchise into the ground, or he could cut his loses and do what he did.

G:

We have 0 1st round draft picks between this year's draft and the next two, AND BRIAN SCALABRINE IS OUR 6TH MAN! How is this good?

I haven't seen much Celtics' basketball in the last couple years, but is Kendrick Perkins any good at all? It is hard for me to imagine this team winning the East even, with no bench and a revolving door for stiffs in the middle.

W:

See, this is really hard to portray while on the board, but I want to reiterate how much I DO agree with the marketing, ticket sales, and relevancy points. I just think that we gave up wayyyyyy too much and that there was no leverage on the side of the T-wolves to merit that much value in return for KG.

What was their alternative? They hold on to an even more disgruntled franchise player, who they tried to trade for 2 months, and they go no where with him. Super. We just bailed McHale out basically.

So, in the end, what you have is a GM who had no real long-term plan, so he drove a franchise into the ground for 5 years and then jumped ship. It just makes me ashamed to be a Celtic fan when there is SO MUCH wrong from the top down in terms of how this team is being assembled.

I agree, the Celtics will be HIGHLY entertaining to watch this year. They should win 50 games.

I must mention one thing I didn't when I was just listing pieces, and that is the fact that Sabby Telfair is next to worthless, so dumping him is good at this stage (we won't go into how we acquired him); those 1st rounders will probably be in the 20-30 range, which doesn't amount to that much; and Theo Ratliff is just a contract and nothing more. In terms of aggregate talent, we basically gave up Gomes, Green, and Jefferson, who comprised a young core that might not have won us much in the next 4-6 years.  

S:

I would have liked to have kept Gomes in the deal. I think he's an athlete with a great attitude who can eat some minutes and get hot every now and then.

Kidd, Jefferson, and Vince dont balance as well as Truth, Shuttles, and KG. Plus, having a big man in any trinity of players is key. Having KG down low, Truth slashing, and Allen on the perimeter will open up opportunities for other players to develop with little pressure.

And finally, from—who else—the Sports Guy:

"For Ainge, the Allen trade was going all-in for the flush and the KG trade was getting that fifth spade on the river. Of course, he's also the reason we were low on chips in the first place, but that's the thing about poker even during the most dire times, you're always one lucky hand away from turning things around. For one of the few times since Larry Bird retired, the Celtics lucked out. Now it looks like they can contend in the East. Now the Celtics are on TNT and ESPN for more than two appearances. Now Barkley and Kenny aren't making jokes about us, and free agents actually might want to play for us, and my dad isn't bemoaning the fact that he just threw away money for season tickets again. The Boston Celtics are back. Repeat: The Celtics are back. Even if we had to give up two top-seven picks and the best young low-post player in the league to get there."

So who's right in this debate over the future of the Boston Celtics?

Who knows.

The one thing that's certain is that my fantasy league is doing its job: keeping the Celtics' front office in check by dissecting every possible outcome of its most recent move.

That's what fans are for—We fill the seats, but We're also the Fourth Estate. It's our job to call an idiot and idiot and to hold on to the memory of players traded before their time.

What do you think?

 

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