Maybe am left centrist in my values, but I have always had a problem with Sunny Gavaskar. Make no mistake, barring the 36 not out (in 60 overs), he was and still continues to be one of the most successful batsmen in the history of the game. His final innings of 96* against Pakistan was a gem.
But allow me to present a premise—and then substantiate it.
My biggest reason for this indifference towards such an icon is because "He Wields his Moralistic Axe," more times than others, and quite heavily too. That makes me uncomfortable.
Let's not talk cricket, let’s just talk the current world with Indian engineers shaping the future of information technology in Northern California, Indian business graduates presenting about India’s energy security in a conference in Perth (Western Australia), a vintage blonde American strolling the streets of Chennai for a team project.
The crystallized geographical and cultural boundaries among the nations in the globe become thinner and slender…as time progresses.
It requires a more comprehensive understanding on cultural differences between countries. The more we develop, the more we lose the leeway to not understand the cultural differences between us.
A god-fearing upper middle class scholar from Chennai or Kolkata is quite obviously going to think different from a bloke who grew up fishing in Brisbane, or someone who grew up on the upper east side of Manhattan (NY). We think different—and that’s not our fault, that’s how we grew up.
Go to Sydney, and put your arm around your mate and say, "You are 30 minutes late you bastard." Nine times out of 10 it is not derogatory. Do the same thing in South Madras, the word "bastard" it is quite consummately not only derogatory, but singularly offensive.
Want to meet someone whom you are interested in, call her up and ask her out for a drink and vintage dinner in Nobu
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about 1 month ago
I don't know LJS. I feel that Gavaskar is correct at many levels.
It's odd, but I fit the example you're giving - of a guy from South Chennai.. lol. But, things are not as conservative as they are made out to be around here. It's also a known fact that the Australians are great off the field.
But the fact remains that they literally stole the Sydney test.. a fact that not many Indians will forget for a long, long time. Pathetic umpiring and gamesmanship didn't help either. The fact that Harbhajan was targeted and fell prey to this "tactic" that the Aussies use - and Symonds subsequently doing what he did, just went to prove that things had backfired for the Aussies.
Australia are now easily, the most hated team in India.. I'm not even sure if people dislike Pakistan quite so much.
One of the things I agree with Gavaskar is the fact that players from the sub continent get treated poorly by the likes of Chris Broad, and other European/South African referees. I simply don't like the fact that when an Indian/Pakistani/Sri Lankan does something "wrong," he gets pulled up, but that doesn't happen when an Australian or a South African does the same/a similar thing.
Perspective is the key here.. I personally don't think that the Indians will ever feel on level ground with the Aussies and the likes due to the refs. Until that happens, I'm quite sure you'll hear the little master come out and say things - right or wrong, which will wind the Aussies up for sure.
from about 1 month ago
do you really blame the OZ boys - for sydney .... blame Bucknor ? may be
in the sense - many mistakes (except second innings Roy) were against India, i still think it was bucknor
i dont get why they are hated - well, i can sort of see ... ferrari are not liked that well either -cos the scarlet is so successful
i actually do agree with you on the sub-continent umpires - being treated bad
daryl hair has no place in a diplomatic world - he am afraid is very inappropriate
i think the indians do feel very level with OZ - i dont think am gonna agree wit that mate, they are a lovely team and they are one of the most beloved teams down under ...
cheers
from about 1 month ago
Maybe today they are LJS, because of Ganguly.. but before that, I'm not so sure.
Yes, I blame a lot of the Aussies as well because they were simply far to arrogant in the way they played the sport - of course, it might be something un intended but I just don't think that the Indians got a good deal at Sydney - from the umpires or from the players.
Symonds didn't walk even once, when he was out... what? 3 times.. I'm not saying that he should have, but "good, hard cricket" means that you're fair.. clearly the Australians set a very poor precedent.
The Australians thrashed us in 2003 (WC Final), and people didn't really dislike them much then.. it was only after this series that people have started "hating" them - considering that they've achieved so much success since then (or lack thereof), I'm not sure how you can compare them to Ferrari.
PS. Even Cricket Australia showed a distinct lack of class by not inviting Gavaskar to hand the Border-Gavaskar trophy to the Australians at the time.. a distinct lack of class that, I might add.
from about 1 month ago
yeah - agree on the CA needed to have invited sunny (even after all his candid comments in the box)
No - if you think playing hard fair cricket - is about walking, you are just WRONG
why - because its a one way road,
if you nicked it and walked, you arent allowed the leeway to stay even if you did not nick it (but given out wrongly)
i think stephen waugh plays hard fair cric - he does not walk mate
- if a player is expected to walk, then he should be able to stay when he isnt out and given out wrong - umpires have a job
let em do that - i'll do mine
when you hate some one - you are indeed acknowledging that- the team is very good
no one hates NZ or Paks - because they are crap
about 1 month ago
May be LJS, you touched on the wrong topic Gavaskar (India) vs Australia, but I think you won't be getting lot of support for your article this time.
There should be one bloke who should stand up to the might of the Aussies. No one ever dared to do that. Forget Poms, they have done that once in Botham era and that has been the talking point till 2005, when Eng defeated Aussies again in the Ashes.
People like Sourav Ganguly because he gave the Australians back what they are good at (not in cricket). I think there is absolutely no wrong in Gavaskar waving the moral axe time and again. Aussies can be aggressive. But if there is no one who is going to stand up to that challenge and tell them what they are doing is right or wrong, then they think that whatever they are doing is right. And they more often than not cross the line.
Gavaskar was very right in reiterating Aussies escape the fine when they sledge but other nations often will be penalised for the same act what Aussies have done on the field, esp subcontinent people. Gavaskar's question is always why sub-continent people + other cricket playing nations are given a separate treatment and Aussies exclusively should be allowed to go on with their acts (sledging etc).
If cricket says sledging or any other thing is not allowed on the field, then every nation should stick to it irrespective of their background and culture. That is why there are called Rules.
When Ramnaresh Sarwan(WI) gave it to McGrath, look at the intensity in the argument. Arjuna Ranatunga(SL) said that Ganguly is the only player in world cricket who stood up to Aussie challenge and got into Steve Waugh's mind in the epic 2001 series. Daniel Vettori recently (NZ) pointed out that Aussies cannot take when someone is aggressive to them. Vettori doesn't come South Madras. Now you have Graeme Smith(SA), Kevin Pietersen (Eng) who care a shit about Aussies and their arrogance (on the field).
Aussies can be warm hearted people outside. Perfect, no problem. On the field, don't expect a special treatment because you have been the world leader.
Just compare the difference between the West Indies (Invincible's) of the 80's and Aussies of the late 90's (Steve Waugh's team) . People love WI's of the 80's even when they used to knock opponents of the field with their deadly pace bowling combination and bouncers. People hate Aussies even though they had two consecutive 16 match Test winning streak, which I think cannot be achieved by any other team in the near future. Why ?
Ok, on another perspective. Why do you think people like Djokovic despite his cockiness? He was the first person to say, I want to be the number 1 in the world when tennis was dominated by solely by Federer and Federer alone. Rafa had it in him but never expressed and was very much contented until Djokovic kicked his ass. That time Djokovic was just 19.
The whole point is there should be someone either from India, or the rest of the world minus Australia, to stand up against Australia and tell them what they are doing is to what level of acceptance. I don't care what Gavaskar was in his heydays, but I think now it's perfectly alright for him being in the ICC committee to let Australia or any other country aware of their behaviour and antics on the field.
from about 1 month ago
first of all -thanks for the long, yet very logical counter-points
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its ok rock - its not about me getting support by only writing about popular things - its about saying what i honestly feel, am fine in not being voted as most popular or not getting most support
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i wanted more discussion in the cric domain - this serves the purpose
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Gavaskar's question is always why sub-continent people + other cricket playing nations are given a separate treatment and Aussies exclusively should be allowed to go on with their acts (sledging etc).
whether you like it or not - fair or not - the BEST teams in any sport are afforded special treatment, Ferrari - LA Lakers - OZ ....
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ICC is like the proverbial United National - big, almost useless and powerless
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If cricket says sledging or any other thing is not allowed on the field, then every nation should stick to it irrespective of their background and culture. That is why there are called Rules.
team orders arent allowed in f-1 - on court coaching isnt allowed in tennis (those are RULES too) ?
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i see and understand your point about vettori and kevin P - and its very very valid - but the NZ or ECB does not go to a paper and asks the aussie boys to behave according to a code of ethics
gavaskar weaves his axe heavy time and again .... its annoyingly judgemental
nothin different from telling - you cant sleep around with many people (its my personal business - stay the hell away)
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People love WI's of the 80's even when they used to knock opponents of the field with their deadly pace bowling combination and bouncers. People hate Aussies even though they had two consecutive 16 match Test winning streak, which I think cannot be achieved by any other team in the near future. Why ?
so - who cares Rock, this isnt a popularity contest. no ones gonna remember any team because they behaved well .... winning is everything - sorry, winning is the ONLY thing
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funny - i actually think Nole is everythin like the OZ team - you used to to counter point
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cheers
about 1 month ago
you know Long, i feel you are right....i don't think hard core indian cricket fans will accept the facts that you have pointed out, but yes; there is an absolute difference in the way cricket works in india and australia...as righlty said by you if the aussies swear, it is moralistically incorrect, but when an indian cricketer swears for completing his century or when the opposition has whacked him for a boundary, no person can question that. i can't figure out why?
as regards sunil gavaskar, i know he was a great cricketer et all, but my father always that he was probably one of those cricketers who preferred to stay in the crease till the end, irrespective of the outcome of the match.
and one more thing that i like i about your article, is the statement: aussies are not angels..so fine but thats the way they take their sport whereas we have this uncanny ability to treat everything as offensive...
5* from my side and hope that you will contribute more often.....
from about 1 month ago
whereas we have this uncanny ability to treat everything as offensive
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i love this one line ...
like i said, am not gonna go into whether sledging is correct or not - thats another discussion
but it is indeed perceived differently in many places
gavaskar playing 'holier than thou' is merely - reflecting more about himself than any other
its easy to hate a winner -
cheers -
hope this one creates discussion and brings the members together
about 1 month ago
you know Long, over the years i have observed one thing about the indian cricket team: when they win a match or a series they are perfectly ok with the surroundings, the opposition and all....
but when they lose...all hell breaks through....they will blame the pitch, the curator, the spectators, the scheduling of the matches and of course that the opposition has treated them like vermin.
like you said, the ICC is definitely the proverbial wife, knowing everything but absolutely mute...you should see the way the BCCI bullies ICC when it comes to enquiries....
from about 1 month ago
MONEY TALKS ! dont it -
same way the big boys in f-1 play leverage game with FIA -
about 1 month ago
yeah it does big time....for example....when clive lloyd said that ICL and IPL should co-exist harmoniously, BCCi had the audacity to complain to the ICC to sack Lloyd.....now as the champions league is underway from the 3rd of december, the publicity that the BCCi has given to it, it looks like a mini world cup....i wouldn't be surprised if BCCI replaces ICC sooner....
from about 1 month ago
YEAH - BCCI (before) with dalmiya .... is like fox defending the chickens
i mean - all dalmiya ever cared about was making a quick buck
what a nasty buster -
about 1 month ago
yep he was...he was arrested and was court charges allegedly for swindling the money....but you know in india, we have to choose between the worse and the worst so when we go for the worse...he undergoes training and ultimately ends up being the worst....and because of people like dalmiya the other sports die..but who understands that???
from about 1 month ago
thats the most amazing thing about India and cric
BESIDES all these setbacks - the passion for cric is still overwhelming and its one of the best teams in the world
BESIDES - all these
about 1 month ago
when symonds accused harbhajjan of racism remarks every indian hated symo.....harbhajjan might have said, he may have not...but it was a clear fact that BCCI ended up bullying ICC....
and when gambhir butted watson, why didn't any indian say that was wrong??? on the contrary, BCCI was defending gambhir...but isn't there a difference between physical and verbal assault??? and when it comes to the IPL, we want only australians in the team, why?? beacuse they excellent players..at that time no indian cares about whether he is australian or not....
from about 1 month ago
yeah - i remember harsha saying it too
imagine this - bajji and roy - even played for the mumbai indians in the same team
about 1 month ago
exactly.....no one cares about the national sport: hockey...if you conduct a survey, you would be surprised that 85%of the people might not be knowing the indian hockey team captain...sad plight indeed....
about 1 month ago
actually Long symo and bhajji weren't in the same team.....symo played for deccan chargers while bhajji played for mumbai indians....
about 1 month ago
I actually don't mind Gavaskar ranting at the Oz boys. It ticks them off, and when they are ground to dust in every corner of the world by the best batting line up the world has seen in a century of Test cricket, their frustration is bound to show in the form of stupid verbal vollies, illegal appeals for catches (Ponting, Clarke), not to mention mis-hearing "racist words" (yeah right!) like monkey! if monkey is racist then any son of a gun yelling "son of a bitch" on a cricket ground needs to be banned for life from now on! And believe thats quite a common phrase along the 22 yards!
First things first, Gavaskar has cricketing records Ponting will never get, like being the first to 10,000 runs, first past 30 Test centuries, and quite a few tons against the best pace unit ever seen. Comparatively, Punter has one Test century to show in India!
Australia's era is over. No two ways about it. India, South Africa, Sri Lanka, Pakistan, even West Indies have better fast bowlers, England have better swing bowlers, India have the best batting talents in the world, all of whom are far younger than Hussey, Clarke, Ponting and Hayden.
Spinners are non existent in Aus. Yeah Krejza got 12 in Kanpur, but they cost in 30 a piece! And he only got em coz the bats were going after him, and Brett Lee was down with illness, not at his best hence.
You should read Ian Chappell's recent article on cricinfo.com, about pontings lame excuses for slow over rates. Gavaskar has not grudge against the Australians. All he has is an issue with partiality shown by Steve Bucknor, who has single handedly given Tendulkar more worries than Warne, McGrath, Donald, Akram, Murali et al rolled into one, Hair, Broad etc, who don't seem to think subcontinental people have a right to play cricket.
It is really astonishing how Bucknor is still in the ICC panel.
I say Gavskar should unleash some more salvos. The fact that the likes of Akram are backing what he says, and the usually super vocal Australians still havent had any thing smart to say about the former captain of the third world country means that Gavaskar is quite right in whatever he has said so far!
from about 1 month ago
YOU have valid points - thanks for the response
but i dont understand how this fits in your argument
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First things first, Gavaskar has cricketing records Ponting will never get, like being the first to 10,000 runs, first past 30 Test centuries, and quite a few tons against the best pace unit ever seen. Comparatively, Punter has one Test century to show in India!
Yeah - so ? your point is .... ?
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Gavaskar has not grudge against the Australians - ha ha ha, and yeah, my girl friend is called Princess Diana
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I dont think Bucknor was partial to the OZ boys - i just think he is that BAD
even Roy was not out in the second innings - there is no partiality - its just ineptitude
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Gavaskar is quite right
he might be right - am not questioning that, but you wud be just as pissed if i judge you mate
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cheers
about 1 month ago
"my girl friend is called Princess Diana"
my condolences for your loss chappy, coz i really don't believe Sunny has anything against Australia. He is just pro indian, and his comments tend to be so, therefore it might seem he has a grudge against every team India play! thats not quite true!
what IS true is that Gavaskar, being a better cricketer than Ponting, as proven by the facts i gave previously, should not be questioned for criticising a team he feels is taking it too far, and a captain who is letting his men go out of control.
"I dont think Bucknor was partial to the OZ boys - i just think he is that BAD"
he is not partial to Oz, he just hates India. He has given Tendulkar unfairly out about 12 times in Test cricket! it makes me shudder. i mean it is So apparent that he has something against the team. by some in human intervention, he saved India's arse on one occasion, when he decided not to call for the third umo, when replays showed Laxman was well short of his crease in the run out appeal. ofcourse he had already got an 100 by then, and India lost the game by D/L, but still.
"but you wud be just as pissed if i judge you mate"
if you were the Dalai Lama, or Nelson Mandela or Mahatma Gandhi, and you judged my life, i couldnt be pissed at you!
Gavaskar is an all time great cricketer, who has judged a cricket team. He destroyed the Windies in his time, when most other batsmen shitted themselves by just looking at Marshall and Joel "the hawk" Garner! And his verdict is Australia stretch the rules, and the umpires and referees let it slide, time and again. And that is really pissing off. If Tendulkar can be picked up for ball tampering, i think Ponting can be for slow over rates. Hasnt happened so far, after he screwed up in 3 consecutive Tests.
from about 1 month ago
again Anon
you go on and on about how wonderful a cricket Gavaskar is - thats not nothing to do with how he behaves
can site the very number of times when brilliant cricketers act in unreasonable ways - so the fact thast he scored 10,000 runs
or he is way better better than Punter - actually proves NOTHING
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if you were the Dalai Lama, or Nelson Mandela or Mahatma Gandhi, and you judged my life
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There is an inherent assumption that - they were always correct in anything, they are human beings too
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anyone in Beijing will disagree with Lama - no one is perfect, the chinese govt. will
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your inclination for idol worship (and Gavaskar is hardly a global idol of the three men above) - is sickening
cant expect to have a reasonable discussion with you -
cheers
from about 1 month ago
you speak like every other average indian fan
bucknor does not hate you, bucknor is just tht BAD -
from about 1 month ago
Gavaskar is an all time great cricketer, who has judged a cricket team. He destroyed the Windies in his time, when most other batsmen shitted themselves by just looking at Marshall and Joel "the hawk" Garner!
- again, just mindless rambling about irrelevant facts ....
yeah so - he is a wonderful batsman - so ? got nothin to do with his moralistic righteousness
you shud stop ramblin' mindlessly anon
about 1 month ago
I have no clue why are taking this all in a personal and offensive manner.
i just responded to what you asked, how my points regarding Gavaskar had anything to do with the thread.
and believe im not a blind worshiper of Gavaskar, anything but.
China may disagree with the Dalai Lama, but then the whole world disagrees with them.
They were all human beings, but they made examples out of themselves on how to best lead lives, they are not perfect, but as close as we have gotten as a race to perfection.
Gavaskar is one such individual, who has the knowledge of the game, and the reasons behind criticizing the Oz team are with the betterment of the team at heard
from about 1 month ago
absolutely no offense taken mate - i just put forward my points, just like you did
about 1 month ago
*heart
about 1 month ago
Long, you are right on. Gavaskar doesn't think for a moment before he says something. He is not deliberate and careful with his words as he was with his bat. He spouts out whatever comes to his mind with the very limited vocabulary he has. Perhaps he should comment in Hindi or Marathi when he wants to make a serious point as it is simply lost in his English.
Recently in the India Australia test series out of no where he took Ponting to task for apparently asking what Bishen Bedi was doing at the Aussie nets. Without even recounting any of the facts of what happened to those listening, he went on his rant on how great Bishen was, how he was helping Australian bowlers, and how insensitive Ponting was (in not acknowledging that). Gavaskar wasn't asking any questions. He apparently knew everything and wanted to condemn someone. Usually it is the Aussies.
The contrast couldn't be stark. The other commentator teaming with Gavaskar was Border (I think).
He calmly diffused the situation by listenting to all Gavaskar had to say, and then by acknowledging the greatness of Bedi and also wondering as to why Ponting would be surprised at seeing Bedi at the nets. See, we still don't know the facts.
from about 1 month ago
i guess you stole the words out of my mouth
sunny is very shrewd in the fact - that he decides on something and then goes out and finds the necessary events that support his case
true - very true
about 1 month ago
hi bro,
I think GAVASKAR did let his emotions take control of him. I am very much sure he dislikes Australian Cricketers' attitude. Most of them if not all and ponting's the most.
It all started because its only the Indians and other sub-continent teams who suffer. If You talk of sledging , Aussies are rated X. Mcgrath should have been banned for life for his comments on Sarwan.
Instead he went unpunished. Many things like this might have forced Gavaskar to develop that hatred
.
And Ponting Should have let Gavaskar's comments bother him long time ago. Instead he only fought back.
And so this vicious circle. Many cricketers like Ian Chappel, Moin Khan, Javed Miandad, Kapil Dev commented on Tendulkar..... AND he just let his bat do the talking. He respected his elder Cricketers. Didnt go at them .
It is better if Ponting leaves it alone. Next time Gavaskar wont have have a chance to go at him.
Nice thoughts bro.
from about 1 month ago
no - i was saying
you are perf right in the fact that, punter should just ignore him completely, because the comments come only if you let the other bloke know that you take those to heart
you are very right
from about 1 month ago
But i doubt he will. Ponting being ponting he will attack.
Hope it just doesnt afect his game.
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