Back in February, Shaquille O'Neal debuted with, at the time, one of the elite Western Conference powerhouses, the Phoenix Suns.
The plan was supposed to be foolproof—move a disgruntled All-Star for a proven winner whose won a championship for every team he's been traded to.
Looking at his career stats, one couldn't help but feel that he is the missing piece to an already-dominant Western Conference Team.
Yet this facade was easily proved wrong, and the championship dreams of the city were crushed in an increasingly-easy five games by the Spurs. The series was supposed to be a battle, but turned out to be a clinic.
This proves that either Shaq never really got in tune with the system of the Suns, or, like most believe, Phoenix gave up a lot more then they gained with this monster trade.
Negatives
At the end of last season, the Suns gave up their primary "big man" defender in Kurt Thomas to try and get under the salary cap. Those attempts are all but destroyed with the trade for Shaquille O'Neal.
The Suns also gave up their glue man in Shawn Marion. Shawn was the one who covered up the holes in their system. He is almost as reliable as Amare on the break, he plays out of position yet makes it seem like it's not much of a disadvantage, and he's one of the best offensive and defensive players on the team, if not the league.
Marion fit well into the offense, because he can finish strong at the rim, yet has range all the way out to the three-point line. Though he was disgruntled, Shawn still came out every night and proved that he was among the elite forwards in the league.
The Suns showed in the series against the Spurs that their pick-and-roll defense is very poor. Shaq is too slow at this point in his career—and it showed when Tony Parker and Tim Duncan, in essence, ended the Suns' season with their well-calculated offense, which centered on the pick and roll during that specific series.
Though these negatives took a heavy toll of the Phoenix Suns this season, some do believe that the Suns can still compete for a championship next year. If training camp goes according to plan, expect a different-looking Suns team to make a splash in a very competitive Western Conference.
Positives
Shaquille O'Neal fills the paint. Even though he is not an exceptional defender, his size merits him great rebounding prowess. His size also makes many believe he is an above-average post defender. These two abilities fill two of the Suns greatest needs—interior defense and rebounding.
Perhaps the greatest upside to this deal is the newfound flexibility to play Amare at the four. In terms of athleticism, Amare is perhaps the most dominant power forward in the game today.
Since Amare is no longer responsible for defending centers larger then him, he can exert his will on the offense. And Amare is almost impossible to guard off the pick and roll.
29 comments Last one added 11 months ago — Leave a Comment
Richard Le 11 months ago
Typo on the title, lol. *Phoenix
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Richard Le 11 months ago
there, the title's fix :D
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Baily Deeter 11 months ago
You are right about Shawn Marion and Thomas was a great defender
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sam the fact checker 11 months ago
you forgot a negative...shaq will be taking about 20 million $ from the suns salary cap for the next 3 years or soo...and you also forgot to mention that shaq is getting old...
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Richard Le 11 months ago
I mentioned the salary cap but ure right, I did not make the age thing clear
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A-Train 11 months ago
It was a good move.
You have to understand the Suns had two choices:
1. Keep Marion, lose in the playoffs, and then lose Marion to free agency
2. Trade Marion, lose in the playoffs, but have "something" to show for having lost him
The Suns wanted to cut Marion loose because they had no intention of re-signing him. But how do you cut a fan favorite without sending the message to fans that you're not giving up the season? So the Suns looked for a deal in which they'd get something in return that would (a) keep them competitive and (b) keep the fans interested.
Say what you will, but Suns fans were excited to get Shaq.
The Suns lacked in the half court offense. They lacked in having a defensive presence in the middle. While Shaq is no longer a good defender, he eats up space and grabs rebounds. He's also a good passer, which is great considering the fast break can start with him.
Nash is at the end of his career and basically two years away from retiring. Shaq has two more years left as well. This is like a last hurrah. They'll see what they can do with Nash, Shaq, Amare, Diaw, etc. In two years, the Suns will have plenty of money to build around Amare.
The Suns made smart moves... can't be on top forever.
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Hugh Jass 11 months ago
Ya know, it's safe to judge a trade once the playoffs are over.
I think it's safe to say that the Shaq trade was a terrible trade.
He screwed them for the next 3 years. The Suns aren't going to win a championship in the next 3 years. We all know that.
You forget that Amare is human. He gets older each year. And each year takes a toll on his knee. Okay, he will be awesome. He'll still be an all-star. But rebuilding takes more than one season bro. By the time that they are finished rebuilding, he might not want to be the piece to rebuild around.
Face it Suns fans, you're all screwed.
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Branden Leeman 11 months ago
SHAQ KILLED THE SUNS THAT WAS THE WORST DEAL IN HISTORY HES SLOW HE RUIND THERE TEAMS FAST BRAKE DUNK STYLE SO TELL ME WHER HE FITS IN THERE NO WHERES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HES SLOW OLD AND FAT
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yungCaucasoid ... 11 months ago
Shawn Marion is the only thing that kept PHX in it. Nash is the liability here. Its sick how many folk try to avoid the issue. Shaq won't help The Suns win anything, as long as the worst (PG) defender in the NBA is on that team; STEVE NASH.
Marion was made the *fall guy* for Nash's on-Court liabilities. Marion didn't have a bad attitude, he was sick of (years) taking the blame for under-achieving *dead-weight Caucasoid players* and their shortcomings which victimized The Suns.
Mark Cuban, is brilliant, as he long realized that Nash is a liability. So he hurried and welcomed Nash, to...BEAT IT!! As long as Nash is Phoenix, the Suns will suck, and go home early...ask Tony Parker!
I feel sorry for Terry Porter, as long as Nash is there. He's going to have to cater to Nash *then take the blame* for Nash's liabilities and shortcomings on the court, which caused The Suns to go home early for the past 4-5 seasons.
Shaq is cut for a defensive situation, which the Suns, are not. They are a run'n-GUN, celebrity-summer classic, go-home-early from The playoffs team, as long as Nash is there. Plus, as we saw against the Spurs, the NBA is tired of Shaq. They want him to go to the pasture even though he can still be very very very effective, but don't worry, the league will make sure he isn't allowed to be. Against the Spurs...the refs took him totally, and 100%, out of his game that made him famous.
Get mad at my words all you want, Nash-lovers, just make sure you Understand that you'll only use YOUR PASSION to contest me...as I'm using facts that you all hate, to have to think about.
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Matt Jacobs 11 months ago
Again, how did Stoudemire match up against Duncan? Oh that's right Duncan ate his lunch. How did Marion match up again Manu? Oh right....Manu took him to the woodshed.
Your "facts" are suspect and you completely discredit yourself when you try to blame Nash singlehandedly for the Suns not advancing. Nash is responsible for his part, but you can't argue that the real culprits in the Suns mess is D'Antoni. The only worse defensive coaches I've ever seen are Don Nelson and George Karl.
If you knew basketball and anything other than JJ Redick is an overrated turd, you would leave Nash alone and accept him for what he is......one of the best true PGs in the game
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yungCaucasoid ... 11 months ago
Sorry Matt,
Manu didn't kill Marion, nor The Suns. Marion guarded the 3-spot, Raja Bell guarded Ginobilli, still...Ginobilli is NOT who sent the Suns home. Tony Parker did. Period.
Go back and review footage of the past two playoff series they had. And, correct me if I am wrong please, but...
did or did not The Suns *go home early* at the hands of The Mavs recently? Check that footage as well, if I'm correct ---notice who had a field-day--- on Nash.
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Alex McVeigh 11 months ago
uh, in fact, they did not go home early courtesy of the Mavs. Maybe if you werent wrapped up in being an idiot, you could remember that it was the Spurs.
Nice try though.
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Matt Jacobs 11 months ago
Now you're completely contradicting yourself. Did you or did you not say Marion guards the best player from SG-PF? Don't make me find that comment. If Marion was such a great defender, why wouldn't he be on Manu?
I noticed you left the Amare-Duncan alone. I guess the best PF EVER had nothing to do with why the Suns went home.....
I understand you hate Nash, and you're entitled to your opinion (no matter how dumb it is). But, wehn you say he is solely responsible for the Suns not winning a championship, well that's just silly talk as I've proven beyond a shadow of a doubt
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yungCaucasoid ... 11 months ago
A-Train,
Can't be on top forever?
When were the Suns ever on top??????? They've been under-achieving since Nash arrived!
man. please. stop embarassing yourself.
matta'fact...log off, immediately, and go get 'a clue'
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Robert Kleeman 11 months ago
Under-achieving since Nash arrived?
So, winning 20-something games (when both Marion and Stoudemire were on the team) is better than reaching the Western Conference Finals and losing to a four-time champion?
The only reason anybody picked them to do squat was because Nash showed up with D'Antoni and made the system work.
If the MVP award was about the best player, then Kobe Bryant, Kevin Garnett and now LeBron James would duke it out for the award. However, it is a regular season award that rewards winning. Nash's Suns won 40 more games the year he showed up. I don't make the rules or guidelines. Consider me a messenger.
No one who knows basketball will refute his defensive deficiency. Got it. Thanks. Just because a player plays sub-par defense does not make him useless. And this is coming from a defense-first guy.
Your rants also displease me because you give no credit to my team for being great. The Spurs are the class of this decade and maybe instead of just saying that Tony Parker did it by himself, you could realize that the Suns lost to a better TEAM.
Sure, Parker torched the Suns in 2005 and 2007, but Ginobili and Duncan did the same. That's why it's called a big three.
I have read some comments that prove you know some basketball so I figure you are not a B/R troll. I will echo someone else's sentiments. Write something of your own instead of just posting hateful comments anytime Steve Nash is mentioned in an article. Sheesh.
I would welcome reading one of your articles, so have at it.
And quit using the word caucasoid. You would sound far more intelligent if you used a real word.
Maybe instead of blaming Nash for everything, you should blame anyone who picked them to win a championship. I never did and I was right.
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Ananda krishnan 11 months ago
I thimk you all are talking s**t.shaq will bring home the cup when he does you all are gonna be crying for your mom?????????he might be old but he will still kill every team.when the time comes you will see it.the king the god the great shaq will be the best|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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Steven Resnick 11 months ago
Shaq makes Amare more effective. Even though Shaq is aging he still can get you rebounds and he was their best defender on Tim Duncan in the playoffs that they've seen in recent memory. Shaq gave Duncan a hard time, but the problem is that Shaq was the only one on the Suns that actually tried defensively. The Suns would much rather try to push the ball up even when they have Shaq who can still dominate in the low block because of his strength. Shaq was a good pick up for the Suns, but still it will not help until the team is on the same page defensively. With that being said the most likely time that will happen is when Nash is on the bench. Nash doesn't know he meaning of the word defense.
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yungCaucasoid ... 11 months ago
Matt,
you're the dummy, with pro-Racist posts, on top of that. Marion was the Suns defensive Bull until Raja Bell arrived, to let Marion concentrate on defending front-court players. And whenever Bell was injured, The Suns went back to the old strategy of letting Marion guard 'whoever' was the oppositions best player. Its' a shame, all of that structuring a roster around one man's Division II-A defensive liability.
So, try hard as you can, still...you won't be able to trump the truths I extend about "who" is the reason the Suns suck. Period.
And, for the record, Nash is one of my favorite players...but that won't stop me from telling the truth about him, and the rewards he undeservingly reaps/being caught in the middle of a White-racist controlled league.
Don't forget, after that 2nd UNDESERVED MVP...he pissed the league off, when he accepted the trophy and said, "If they gave this award to the best player, then I wouldn't even be in the running, let alone standing here receiving it."
I've been hyped on him, everysince.
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Matt Jacobs 11 months ago
Again, you completely ignore my points of coaching and stoudemire and your focus on race and kobe bryant.
That just proves that I am right in my point of view and you have no argument whatsoever and need to deflect the attention off my points and on to other ones.
Again, I make you look stupid
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Norm Johnson 11 months ago
Never Champions, just the most exciting team in the NBA for 3-4 years, the Suns then did what they have done for most of the last 40 years. Destroyed their own team in favor of an "Instant Championship". O'Neal, as great as he was, had no reason on such a team as the Suns were under D'Antoni. Who ruined the Suns? Steve Kerr.
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yungCaucasoid ... 11 months ago
Norm,
please don't disrespect your basketball knowledge. The Suns underachieved, continually, since Steve Nash took over. This is 2008 my friend. Exciting does NOT = NBA CHAMPIONS. Have you forgot what the pennacle of the sport is? Have you forgot what Nash claimed to be trying to achieve? Just like, every other NBA player?
It's not even funny, how you want to *selectively* and peculiarly discount that reality now. The past 3 seasons have saw the Suns start summer vacation, earlier, than they were picked/expected to.
it is what it is, Norm, there's no denying that. Steve Nash is a liability, one, which will cost Terry Porter his job in a few years...just watch
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Kevin Nolan 11 months ago
i completely disagree. Just because the Suns were hyped doesn't mean that they were the better team on paper. IMO the Suns lost to a more better constructed teams. Thats not underachieving. The Pistons underachieved when they lost to the Cavs. Thats different
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Robert Kleeman 11 months ago
Nash deserves as much blame as anyone for key turnovers in the fourth quarter of game five in this year's playoffs. He underpeformed and gets his due blame for that.
The Spurs exposed problems that have plagued Shaq throughout his career. He has always defended the pick and roll poorly and refuses to work on his free throw shooting.
What the O'Neal acquisition did was allow a smart team like the Spurs to use him as a disruption to the Nash/Stoudemire offense. By hacking O'Neal and gambling that he would miss his free points, the Spurs forced Stoudemire to touch the ball less and he has to score to stay interested in the game.
You have to give Steve Kerr credit for trying to add a bulky presence to a team with some of the poorest interior defense in the league. He swung for the fences, and even if his ball hit a snail on the sidewalk, at least he swung.
Kerr has some testicles. Even if he is a moron (in his own words), at least he's a proactive one.
Shawn Marion defended Tony Parker as well as anyone else in the NBA. Playing with the Suns allowed Marion to show his unparalleled versatility. What's sad is that Marion works best as a third option but clearly did not want to assume that role in Phoenix.
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yungCaucasoid ... 11 months ago
Robert,
Yes, the Suns have been Under-achieving since Nash arrived. Not many multiple-MVP winners, go without winning Championships ----especially when picked to be in the running for a championship---- only to go home disappointedly-early, summer after summer.
I'm not letting Nash off the hook, but you can, as I will continue to use facts to show how he does not deserve anything but scrutiny ---------after that first year of him returning to PHX. Also, I notice how you *conveniently refused to discuss how Mark Cuban* had Nash's liabilities and shortcomings exploited/pegged when he escorted him, out of Dallas.
The Suns winning 20-something games (when both Marion and Stoudemire were on the team) is better than reaching the Western Conference Finals and losing to a four-time champion, but after that year --------it's been downhill...and mainly due to Nash's shortcomings, which he continually gets rewarded for.
Nash showed up with D'Antoni and made the system work...for one year. Its been galactic underachieving, since then.
No one who knows basketball will refute his defensive deficiency. It got it, thanks, so now you *please get it* how "it is what it is" when that deficiency keeps winding you up, watching The NBA Finals from your living room. And you're correct, just because a player plays sub-par defense does not make him useless. But, it makes him damn near useless when his subpar defense is causing his team to get torched by Teams with PG's who eat him alive...i.e. Tony Parker, Chris Paul, Baron Davis, Deron Williams, J Kidd, etc....
Your rants also displease me for expecting me to give credit to mediocre, IOW your team is not great. The Lakers and The Spurs -----throw in the Pistons---- are the class of this decade. And thanks to Tony Parker eating Steve Nash alive, you should realize that the Suns lost to a better TEAM.
Parker torched the Suns in 2005 and 2007 ----plus in 2008!---- as Ginobili and Duncan ONLY sometimes did the same. It's called a big three...BUT the big-three was always the key in winning the championship, though not always the key to sending The Suns home early ------Tony Parker usually was!
I try to write something of my own. It just doesn't seem to work out, on my pc...I don't get it. Maybe someone could post one of my articles up -----as a favor---- and denote that it's mine. Since everyone is so quick to criticize me for not righting one, despite my saying over and over that I'm having challenges executing that feature.
And, I'm not posting hateful comments ------at anytime----- about Steve Nash. I'm just speaking truth that folk hate, to have to think about.
Plus, I use the word caucasoid, because it's just that...a word!
Go. google the word. Or, grab a Webster's Dictionary.
You'll find that you're oh-so incorrect by alluding to it not being a real word. Or, you could ask Matt about it. He's already had to curl his tail 'tween his legs, when claiming the same thing as you claim here now, a few weeks ago. And I wouldn't care about sounding intelligent, when I'm simply conversing in a way thats most comfortable for me. Period.
Also, I don't blame Nash for everything. I blamed D'Antoni for as much as I blamed Nash for. D'Antoni didn't have to allow this underachievement project, to come into fruition, as the coach. He could've long accepted that a team is NEVER NEVER EVER going to win in the playoffs, with his style of play. Thats why he's a great fit for The Knicks, at this time, because New Yorkers just want to win in the regular season, get to the playoffs, get beat, and all that is an experience that they haven't had in quite a while. After a few seasons of that, they too, will get pissed because run'n'gun gets nowhere when playoff time comes. D'Antoni only cares about regular season success...so look at the Suns 4-5 years later;
Gone runnin'n'gunning up&down the court, to get nowhere near the Larry A. O'-trophy, fast.
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yungCaucasoid ... 11 months ago
typ-o...meant to type "writing one" and not 'righting one'...and meant to type "I got it" and not 'It got it'
peace
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Curly Morris 11 months ago
The jury is still out. Because the Suns have hired a new coach and obviously will not employ the same offensive tactics as last season, we won't know until the season starts. I'll say this however, I'm no great fan of Shaq, but a motivated Shaq on a team with Steve Nash, Grant Hill and Amare Stoudamire is no laughing matter and certainly a team worth considering for a title run.
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Mark Brown 11 months ago
It wasn't a bad deal. The Suns weren't going to win a title, and Marion was going to leave Phoenix. The Suns will be pretty tough this year, Matt Barnes is a poor man's Marion and Robin Lopez is a very good pick-and-roll defender.
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Richard Le 11 months ago
Matt Barnes is a VERY poor man's Marion. He is mainly there to shoot threes and try to get some garbage buckets in my opinion
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Mark Brown 11 months ago
Barnes is a good defender too, and he is a decent rebounder.
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