Back a number of years, Marvel Comics had a series, for what I know, they probably still issue out random issues, called What ifs.
These fun episodes, pair together creative happenings, like, what if the Thing and Nick Fury wound up on opposite sides of the law?
Well, I was just curious.....what if the Oakland Raiders, never existed?
For the experiment, lets put the Minnesota franchise, where it didn't want to go, in the AFL. Vikings in the AFL?
Secondly, what about Al Davis? He started a nice house in San Diego, picking up the likes of Lance Alworth....would he have started his own happy monster there? Very possible. Would they have become the annoying franchise that rubs the NFL the wrong way? Possible, but doubtful.
How about rivalries? Nothing says rivals, like Denver and Oakland, or KC and Oakland....heck, even San Diego and Oakland love to hate each other.....but what does this do to the interleague rivalry? Seattle came along, in the 70s, to add another team, but does the AFC West get another team thrown into the mix somewhere, like the Oilers? Minnesota would be a stretch for a "west" team....but so would houston.
Would the Oakland Athletics have generated enough interest, for the NFL to consider placing a club here then? After all, with the A's move, it also boosted the desire for the Oakland Alameda County Collesium to be built, finally.
Or, with the failure to land the AFL team, would the A's have remained in KC, and then locked the Royals out of the expansion cycle?
With the Raiders being out of the league, would players like Ken Stabler, Fred Biletnikoff, Cliff Branch, Ray Guy, or Daryl Lamonica ever had a chance to be legendary?
How about Old Man Willie Brown? Would he have kicked around Denver, become bored, and retired, without ever having his moment in the sun?
Obviously, the super bowl in 1976 would have turned out very different.....the Raiders and the Vikings played each other.....would Fran finally have gotten a ring?
And how would this have affected rivalries, in the AFC in all? Would we have seen close to 15 years, of nothing but Steelers vs Dolphins, for the AFC titles? Would we have seen another perfect season, with the talent pool flooding over for these two clubs?
It's doubtful Jim Plunkett's miracle season would have occurred. He probably would have been gone in 1978, 2 years away from the great season that never was.
All in all.....the NFL would be a radically different League, without Al Davis and the Raiders. Because for all the hate, that people have for Oakland....
We do bring a lot to the history of this game. And without it, the league sure would feel a lot different.
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2 months ago
yall are sad
from 2 months ago
Why jake?
Wouldn't have anyone to hate, who would you hate then?
Or, without Al Davis to force the NFL into a merger, the broncos fold as a club?
Climb out of your little fantasy world, and enjoy a good read, or go back to your Madden 08 world.
2 months ago
RC,
Nice look back in time...as a Raider fan it was interesting, even though the entire exercise was pointless.
Every other team can look at the what if scenario in the same manner....nothing novel here.
It also fuels the fire for those Raider-Haters that say we drink too much "historical" cool-aid.
ps: Let's not forget...the tuck-rule...no Brady run...no 3 rings for BelaCheat.... lol...it's a lot of fun I must say.
from 2 months ago
Interesting point Tony. Only one really odd question....a greater what-if.
What if Belicheck went back to Drew Bledsoe, after that one year? Would Drew have been able to use the pieces of the puzzle? And what about Brady? Does he get moved to Dallas?
The Al Davis, though, that leaves a lot of details up in the air, and not just with the Oakland franchise. If you wanted to even ask a stronger question, you could always ask, what if Lamar Hunt stayed in the oil business, instead of trying to make the Houston Texans club?
With Al though, more actions, when he became Commish, became more "hands on", like directly using money to attack standing teams where it could hurt. Take out a team's QB, and it becomes really hard to function. I also remember one club going after Dick Butkus, which I can imagine, didn't set well with George Halas.
But at the same time, it also makes a larger question, in general, about a franchise that formed up in 1960, and everyone seems to think the league would be better, if we never existed.
Call it a football's version of "It's a wonderful life".
Really gotta wonder how things would have changed.
2 months ago
2008
2 months ago
I could never see Beldsoe return to the starting job after pretty-boy wins the SB.
Agree with the other points made....
Got a "area" type question...living in Canada, I try to read all the local Bay Area articles online....what's the news on a new stadium for the Raiders??? I believe the mayor of a small community nearby said "no way" to AL.
Just curious.....
T.
from about 1 month ago
Well, the Bledsoe question comes out, if Brady had fumbled, AND the ref got the call right.
Would Belicheck go back to him, or would he keep going back to Brady?
As for the stadium deal, I'm hearing the only deal in place, involves the Athletics, not the Raiders. From what i've heard, it sounds like something out of a nightmare crossing Bill Gates with Billy Beane.
On the same side, I did hear some person mention the idea of trying to have a single stadium for the 9ers and the Raiders, but that wouldn't fly either. What I have seen, regarding the Raiders, would keep them in Network, but maybe once the A's fly the coop, then the Raiders can use it for leverage....after all, it's been around since when, 1966?
about 1 month ago
Yes, lol...that was sad.
There would have still been a merger..go read up.
Players drafted out of college would still play. Raiders or no Raiders..or any team, for that matter.
And save it on the rivalries..there are a ton of rivalries. Your division rivalries only matter to those in the division. No one else cares.
Dolphins-Jets, Browns-Cincy, Niners-Rams, Pack-Vikings, Steelers-Browns, Giants-Eagles, Bears-Packers, and Cowboys and Redskins all view those rivalries as big, or bigger.
Again..one sorry sad thread, to be quite honest.
What? Should I now state "Gosh..without the Niners SD would have a SB ring? Montana would be stocking shelves somewhere..possibly? Rice...blah...blah...blah?
As far as a new stadium??? LMAO..uh...no. Was never an issue. Was never a possiblity. Even the mayor of Dublin laughed and said wasn't more than idle chatter from the babbling boobs in the Raider front office.
about 1 month ago
Actually Mike, considering the players involved in the AFL-NFL merger, who was the Commish of the AFL, at the time of the merger?
Yep, your personal favorite, Al Davis.
Of course, by the same token, who was the assistant coach for the Raiders, in 1966?
Gee, no one else but Bill Walsh, who was taught the West coast offense, by one Sid Gillman, and the work out west.
Thing is, would Plunkett have led another team to a cinderella championship?
Probably not.
Sure, Stabler probably would have landed somewhere....Ray Guy, probably wouldn't have been drafted in the first round, and you probably still wouldn't have pure punters....him getting drafted actually advanced the idea, that punters are a useful item on your team. If you can't kick it 50 yards deep, you better hope your field goal kicker is able to split the uprights at long range.
Thing is, a lot of things occurred, with the Raiders involved. One of the better rivalries, actually came out of the division, was Oakland and the Steelers. How many AFC Championships did those two clubs duke it out in?
Might rival the 9ers and Cowboys for episodes, considering the first real matchup was the Dwight Clark miracle catch.
As for the idea of having 9ers and Raiders in the same stadium, I don't think anyone would put up with that much punishment....it would be like having the Hell's Angels and the Campus Crusade for Christ sharing a hotel....not pretty.
And, as for mike......at least I write articles.....to date, you have no ground to stand on, just mumbling gibberish like some crazy old man, clinging to your belief.
Still, are you sure you're not Al Davis's 49er clone? I see a lot of similar traits.
about 1 month ago
Oh gawd, lmao..."At least I write articles"????
is that what you call it?
Wrong.
What YOU and so many others here tend to do is post the same silly raider drivel, ad nauseum, cut and paste, saying little new.
If you take out the "Everyone hates us" and the "we're the best fans" threads, 90% of raider threads would disappear.
As far as torching your silly takes? With you having little in reply? Yeah, I guess it works for you to state "it's gibberish", yet why is it YOU and so many other Raider "fans' tuck tail between legs, almost begging me to quit picking on you?
Because, as you've shown numerous times, you have no choice.
Now, I know it bothers you that your thread is pointed out as "silly" and "pathetic" but that's because it is.
You ever think before you post? What part of "EVERY TEAM CAN SAY THE SAME THING" confuses you?
NAME A TEAM..ANY TEAM..and I GUARANTEE YOU that I can list players from that team who did well.
So what?? Saying "If so and so team was never created, the NFL would be affected" is stating the obvious, isn't it?
BTW....the Dwight Clark WASN'T the first real matchup. For that matter, going into the final two minutes of that game, that we, of course, won, the Cowboys were driving for a shot at a FG, which, had it been made, would have been the exact same scenario, won by the exact same score, as a game just a few years before between the Niners and the Cowboys, ALSO FOR THE NFC CHAMPIONSHIP. Unfortunately for the boys, White fumbled the same opportunity in '-81, as compared to '78 or so.
And the rest, much to all Raider fans chagrin, is history..a much storied, kickass history, which basically leaves the Raiders in our dust.
I know..stings..doesn't it? lol..
I can tell.
Now, let me help you. When someone, such as moi', instructs you that your sorry take sucks, why bring up something silly like "Who was commish'?? What does that have to do with the fact your thread was pure babble?
Oh, and thanks for bringing up that at one time Walsh was an assistant.
You also noticed which owner gave Walsh his shot as a HC? DeBartelo
Which team that HC made history with? Niners
And which owner let him leave? Davis
What was fun as hell? Watching all that success the Niners had with Walsh, while the Raiders fell into the abyss, never to return, knowing yet ANOTHER coach Al blew it on.
Yeah, lol..I agree with you.
No Raiders..and who would be the laughingstock of the league?????
No Raiders and which team's fans would officially be the absolute worst fans in the NFL for the last 5 years?
No Raiders and where would washed up, over the hill, yet still want a big paycheck players go to die?
Oh..and can't forget...no Raiders? Halloween ends Nov 1. Now? Goons galore :)
from about 1 month ago
Actually, i'm still waiting for an article from you, on how great York has been for the franchise. Or heck, how about how Alex Smith is going to save the 49ers from their present state?
Oh, wait, I remember, you were going to write about why it takes the 49ers from the 40s to the 80s to figure out, you want to win championships, but along the way, try to bully anyone who wants to move into your "neighborhood".
Biggest problem, is you have a lot of hot air.....no solid, factual, or for that matter, meaningful writing.
Kinda like Hillary Clinton.
about 1 month ago
To Mike49er:
You always say you know more about the 9ers and raiders than anyone on this place, yet you haven't made a single article. I dare you to write an article about the 49ers (or if your really that bad at pretending your not a raider fan you can write 1 about the raiders).
2nd, your obviously a raider fan, you can deny. But there's proof. It's in your play-by-play
from about 1 month ago
Correction.
I know more about the Niners, Raiders, AND Rams than anyone on this place...well..at least more than most of those fans.
You're welcome to challenge me, anytime you feel up to it.
Now, considering most of my replies are LONGER than many, if not most of the "articles" here, or on other places, why is it you equate knowledge with actually posting a thread?
If anything I've proven most of the lemming posters here, ESPECIALLY the Raider lemmings, are incapable of an original thought. For that matter, most are reduced to either copying someone else's thoughts and pasting it as their own, or simply copy and paste an article, or worse yet, some ancient history that they, and they alone view as "Unknown up until now".
I mean..look at those that marvel at the fact Bill Walsh once was an asst with the Raiders way back when, as if it's been unknown before now.
As far as threads? Well, lol...I think I probably had a couple hundred threads on the old, now defunct, official Rams board..at least that many of numerous Raider boards, along with much more on Niner boards, much to the chagrin of Ram, and Raider fans..and many..I mean MANY Cardinal fans on their sites. (I don't know as much about the Cards..they're kind of a new rivalry, but seems most of their fans know even less than I do.)
It's offseason..pretty dead around most boards. Like me, most football fans don't frequent boards actively until the season gets closer, especially training camp.
Then you'll be sorry you requested a thread, lol...guaranteed.
Of course, not to say I won't take the time to correct incessant faux pas, kind of a friendly gesture on my part, from Raider, Ram, and Card fans.
I mean..someone has to gently correct you before the season starts..right?
Back to Raider fans..yes..there is no group of less informed fans than Raider fan in general. Oh, I've had LOTS of exchanges with very knowledgeable Raider fans...long exchanges, knew their stuff..but for the most part, those "We duh Raaaaaiderrrrs" fans can't spell Raiders, much less discuss them.
Of course, you're more than welcome to prove me wrong :)
from about 1 month ago
Actually Mike, about all you come across, to most fans, is annoying....you can be an expert on that all you want.
As for this site, how many articles have I written? My homepage says 18.....yours, is still zero. Which leads me to believe, either you're too insecure to write anything, or you simply doubt everything, and afraid to subject yourself to ridicule. Classic paranoia episodes. It's ok, they have therapy for that too, just go see a good head-shrinker.
Althoug, I'll also admit, that another writer on here did make a simple point: Haters are far and few worthwhile. We can enjoy a good article, talking about the Raiders, and what happens? Some pointless peon with a lot of hate comes in....this would be you. Now, unless you actually have something proper, and valued to add on articles, other than insulting tripe, I can start marking you as offensive.
about 1 month ago
No, talking about YOUR weak threads dying off...nice try on a diversion post in order to avoid the question.
Of course, that is your forte', isn't it?
See..YOU stupidly ran your mouth, and I replied with the following.
What was your reply to the following?
NOTHING.
You were reduced to, INSTEAD OF REPLYING TO THE CHALLENGE, retreated, waving the white flag, instead asking me to discuss the Yorks and Alex Smith...means you have nothing, lol...obviously.
But hey..I'll gladly school you on the Yorks, and your Geriatric Dinosaur, Al.
Also school you on Smith, along with all of your sorry joke qb's that your idiot owner decided was a "steal"..Kerry Collins ring a bell? Awesome record of 7-21..How about that awesome signing of Aaron Brooks? McCown? Culpepper? Walter? lol..and now Russell? COMBINED that joke line of qb's record is 11-49.
Now, just for fun, why don't you actually try and back up your words..instead of whimpering about how you're being picked on, while secretly happy I'm bumping back up your dying, oh so dead threads.
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Oh gawd, lmao..."At least I write articles"????
is that what you call it?
Wrong.
What YOU and so many others here tend to do is post the same silly raider drivel, ad nauseum, cut and paste, saying little new.
If you take out the "Everyone hates us" and the "we're the best fans" threads, 90% of raider threads would disappear.
As far as torching your silly takes? With you having little in reply? Yeah, I guess it works for you to state "it's gibberish", yet why is it YOU and so many other Raider "fans' tuck tail between legs, almost begging me to quit picking on you?
Because, as you've shown numerous times, you have no choice.
Now, I know it bothers you that your thread is pointed out as "silly" and "pathetic" but that's because it is.
You ever think before you post? What part of "EVERY TEAM CAN SAY THE SAME THING" confuses you?
NAME A TEAM..ANY TEAM..and I GUARANTEE YOU that I can list players from that team who did well.
So what?? Saying "If so and so team was never created, the NFL would be affected" is stating the obvious, isn't it?
BTW....the Dwight Clark WASN'T the first real matchup. For that matter, going into the final two minutes of that game, that we, of course, won, the Cowboys were driving for a shot at a FG, which, had it been made, would have been the exact same scenario, won by the exact same score, as a game just a few years before between the Niners and the Cowboys, ALSO FOR THE NFC CHAMPIONSHIP. Unfortunately for the boys, White fumbled the same opportunity in '-81, as compared to '78 or so.
And the rest, much to all Raider fans chagrin, is history..a much storied, kickass history, which basically leaves the Raiders in our dust.
I know..stings..doesn't it? lol..
I can tell.
Now, let me help you. When someone, such as moi', instructs you that your sorry take sucks, why bring up something silly like "Who was commish'?? What does that have to do with the fact your thread was pure babble?
Oh, and thanks for bringing up that at one time Walsh was an assistant.
You also noticed which owner gave Walsh his shot as a HC? DeBartelo
Which team that HC made history with? Niners
And which owner let him leave? Davis
What was fun as hell? Watching all that success the Niners had with Walsh, while the Raiders fell into the abyss, never to return, knowing yet ANOTHER coach Al blew it on.
Yeah, lol..I agree with you.
No Raiders..and who would be the laughingstock of the league?????
No Raiders and which team's fans would officially be the absolute worst fans in the NFL for the last 5 years?
No Raiders and where would washed up, over the hill, yet still want a big paycheck players go to die?
Oh..and can't forget...no Raiders? Halloween ends Nov 1. Now? Goons galore :)
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Told you..read up first.
Anyone can cut and paste, like you do.
When someone calls you out, backtracking while saying nothing proves you're a headline poster, nothing more.
about 1 month ago
Mike, do the world a favor. Go away.
Either that or read my most recent article on denial, anger, etc.
It's classically patterned after you....or, if you'd like, i'll single you out in an article, about your inabilty to support your own team, but continually critizise others.....sounds like the man who complains about a mote in his friends' eye, but neglects the beam in his eye.
For every note you leave in Raider articles....it just fortifies the fact, you gave up on the 49ers.
Past, present, and future.
Want to prove me wrong?
Write it....don't comment on it.
about 1 month ago
You got called out for your weak sorry homer, frontrunning, blind as a bat, make no sense comments that you've made quite clear your ONLY intent is blathering on, while accepting the fact you can't back up any of your words.
You're the weakest of the weak, and you're now reduced to begging me to stop schooling you.
Now, unfortunately for you, message boards are set up for people to comment on takes, good or bad.
Unfortunately for you, you've been outed as woefully uninformed about your team.
Let me guarantee it AGAIN. I've likely forgotten more about the Raiders than you've googled. You know..those copied threads you live for, where you just cut and paste someone else's words, few changes, and call it your own.
Which is exactly why, when you get schooled, you're reduced to waving the white flag, meekly pleading for mercy.
And look? LMAO..."You're ripping on the Raiders. You're pointing out all of my mistakes. You must NOT be a Niner fan anymore." Damn dude, I can almost feel the tears running down your cheek, as your little fingers knot up in total frustration in being exposed. Your comments in this thread alone show you truly don't know much about football, much less the Niners or the Raiders.
Deal with it.
You'll learn..in time.
Just keep reading my comments, copy them, study them, and feel free to use them as your own.
After all, why stop now?
about 1 month ago
Oh man...truly laughing my ass off at you pointing out, almost pleading, for me to go to that thread "Anger, Denial, Bargaining, Depression, Acceptance:"
ARE YOU SERIOUS????
I school you, you cry about it, then you ask me to go and revive a dead thread that never lived, where none even applies?
Well, lol...actually...in hindsight, it does.
It's you..to a T.
I post on a thread weeks ago.
You came on with snide bitter little tacky two cent insults, acting all that.
I then ripped you a new one.
RaiderCard=ANGER
I then detailed schooling you while pointing out you tucking tail between legs.
RaiderCard=DENIAL
Your reply was "well, uh...gee...the raiders?? ummm...well...HEY?? uhmm Mike? Why don't you start a thread instead of picking on me?"
RaiderCard=BARGAINING
RaiderCard: "Well, Mike, just go away. You hurt my feelings"
RaiderCard=DEPRESSION
and the coup de grace'??
RaiderCard: "Please Mike, quit ridiculing me. I can't defend my words here, even when you post the challenge again. I accept that. Can't you go start some threads so I redicule you? Please? PLEASE???"
RaiderCard=ACCEPTANCE
No wonder you want me to post on your threads.
Someone should..I suppose.
from about 1 month ago
Mike, pure and simple, bug off. Go bug someone else, since you have nothing of merit to add to articles.....you sound like the heckler in a play.
Since you won't, or can't, post a single article, about your so-called loyalty, or for that matter, anything of value, I will simply ignore you. Goodbye.
about 1 month ago
what are the 5 stages of death and dying?
what do i win, mr trebek??
from about 1 month ago
The right to turn Mike49er upside down and slap him repeatedly.
from about 1 month ago
well, i'm a life long saints fan, and growing up with the niners and saints in the same division for much of my life, i have no love for them.
about 1 month ago
LMAO..wave that white flag, Raider Card...wave it proudly.
No shame in getting slapped into submission.
Oh...but posting "I'm done with you" AND THEN FOLLOWING THAT IMMEDIATELY WITH A POST ABOUT ME makes you dumber than cotton.
And then seeing you go on OTHER THREADS, OUT OF THE BLUE, and then post some stupid whine about me, where the authors asking 'What the hell are you babbling about" where you, with tears in your eyes, post MORE comments about me..lol..IN A THREAD I'M NOT EVEN ON...saying 'He just irritates me. I wish he would stop picking on me. Why does he want me to defend my words. They're my words. " makes you about as big a jellyfish as I've run across.
I'll say it again, little boy.
Two things are imminent.
Your idiot takes getting shredded.
And you tucking your tail between legs, begging others for help, while waving your white flag.
Now, get back to that shallow end of the pool, that I stated from the start is where you'll be all too soon.
No, it wasn't a good guess...watching you backtrack, snivel, and whine it was an obvious guarantee.
Now git, little boy.
from about 1 month ago
Mikey, have you ever thought criticizing articles when you haven't wrote one yourself says something about you? Have you ever thought that it's harder to create than to criticize? No? Oh, just asking.
12 days ago
Good Read - but I also read the comments.
And all I have to say is The Tuck Rule was in the rule book at the time, had been since the beginning of the NFL. Now the official's judgement call was questionable but Vinatieri still had to kick 2 field goals in a blizzard.
It's not like the Raiders didn't have a chance after the fumble.
Raiders blew it.
from 11 days ago
Actually, John, the problem isn't the rule, but more to the point, how the rule was applied to help the Patriots in this case.
For example, say a QB is going to pass. He pumpfakes, then decides the pocket is closing, then starts to scramble. By that point, he is no longer in the process of making a pass, ergo, he is now a running back, and able to fumble a ball away. Which, in this case, he did.
Now, looking at it in slow motion, had he been say, in the action of throwing a pass, ie, arm moving forward, etc, then, it would be an incomplete pass.
Which way was his arm going? Down into his body, or forward, to throw the ball?
Even people for say, ESPN, NFL Network, and about 90 percent of the people who saw the game, saw a fumble.
Thanks to one ref, and a vague interperetation....the Patriots regained the ball.
Of course, if you also want to use the raiders had the game won logic, and say they gave up, did you ever time, how long it took for them, from the fumble, to Brady's next snap?
These players got to be out on the field, for about 30 minutes, when they should have been in the locker room, enjoying a party.
Then, one ref took it from them.
Playing football after being ripped off isn't easy....just ask the Raiders, after we beat the broncos with a field goal kick.
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